[samsite]

Originally Posted by DesiGuru

1.The point has already been made here... ISB COSTS a lot of money... and they can make it all sound good... But at the end of the day if you are really a smart businessman you know paying 15 lakhs for an education in India when an equally good education with a better TAG exists is called plain stupid

2.And you only go to ISB if you fail to make it into an IIM for two-three years... That is the reality of india ... Maybe a 19 year old from Tennesse cannot understand the ground realities in India .
If you are Indian and you live in India. IIM is your first goal. And if you cant make it you go to ISB which is an equal or better school.

3.The point is you should talk about ISB independently of the IIMs. Because if you compare you will be screwed But you could very well talk about all the salient features in their entirety and then expect smart people to choose on their own by looking at all the advantages and disadvantages on both sides...


K

@DG
hmm well lets see,you have mentioned that a person takes an ISB admit only when he /she fails in CAT for two or three years and you also have posted elsewhere that if given a chance of a full schol in ISB who will chuck IIMA for it.My argument is that all those people who go to ISB with two or three attempts at cat is only because
1. they need a certain minimum work-ex to apply thier
2. it costs too much as stated by you in point 1 and also that IIM's are the best deal

sire i really wish for you to stop this unnecessary debate on this thread as you have also maintained that there is no comparison between the two b-schools and also because readers will like to see "DesiGuru" spending more time and posting much better stuff elsewhere.

regards
samsite

[DesiGuru]

@samsite...

Sure I will vote for you if you want to be Mod
K

[AddyJ]

DG,

In my earlier posts I have said things like:

1. I am as Indian as any other Indian on this forum.
2. I did not know that if someone went abroad to study, he bacame a foreigner.
3. I have friends from school that go to IIT.

etc. etc.

I dont know what you gives you an idea that I only read American books blah blah blah and that I don't understand the ground realities of India. Or are you trying to say that anyone who disagrees with you does not understand India and its realities as a whole?

Now that you repeatedly refer to me as an outsider, let me clarify once and for all that I am from Delhi (I think I mentioned this earlier too). I went to school there all my life, and came to study in the States 2 years ago. If that makes me a foreigner, then I guess you are nowhere close to being an Indian as you were there for 4 years, longer than me.

Abey tu kab tak meri Bharatiyata ko lalkarega!!??!!

If you understood the ground realities of India yourself, you would know that you cannot mess with a proud Indian!!

[DesiGuru]

@AddyJi

Firstly Cool off If you really are a 19 year old you write pretty well relatively speaking. But try and acknowledge the fact that you are someone who could afford an undergraduate degree from the US.As far as I know that involves a expenditure touching 50 lakhs in total and mostly upwards of that in most cases. For someone like that the monetary costs of ISB are irrelevant. And when you remove the COST Factor ISB surely rocks as me, nex as well as others itself have agreed...

The education that you will get at ISB could be of a higher quality than IIM even now... But its the quality of students that IIMs attract and its alumni that makes it special... Again remembering that education makes hardly any difference in long term success. Because most of the best businessmen seem to do without any MBA... So lets leave this discussion and if you want to continue praising ISB try doing it independently of IIM or elsewhere in the many threads here... You are sure as hell welcome to do that

Welcome to this site
K

[krishsuraj]

Originally Posted by AddyJ

Guys,

I have been talking about the IIMs not being as good as the ISB. Probably, you feel that I dislike it. Don't get me wrong! If I would have stayed in India, I would have tried for the IIMs. I used to listen to people talk about it, and always thought of it as the best availible.

But now that I am learning about the ISB, I think that the only thing it lacks is the brand name. It is not as well known around India. But I personally think that it is a better school cause it allows for students to learn from each other because they have work experience.

The guys at the IIMs are probably the brightest in India. They can do all the crazy calculations and crack the CAT. But I just seem to have a problem with the concept of choosing inexperienced candidates. On the other hand, even the US B schools are now offering more candidates admissions without full time experience. But that number is around 2% at Harvard and Stanford and 1% at Wharton, not, maybe, 70% or more like the IIMs.

This is what the Wall Street Journal has to say:

In a recent Wall Street Journal/Harris Interactive survey, recruiters' most frequent complaint is that M.B.A. students lack enough "relevant" experience. Most recruiters say they expect a minimum of four or five years of experience, preferably in their industries.
"The M.B.A. candidate with zero experience is basically still a kid," says John Paul Komasinski, a survey respondent and CEO of Komasinski Business Solutions, a marketing and technology consulting firm. "Management requires very special people skills, attention to details, organization and coolness under fire. None of these qualities is apparent in a green M.B.A. student."

I dont think there should be a minimum work experience requirement anywhere, but choosing the massive majority without it is different. The IIMs are affordable and good, but do not follow the same formula as the best in the world.

The ISB has parteners like Wharton and Kellogg. Why dont the IIMs? What sets schools are Harvard etc. apart from the rest is its great selection process. In the class there are diverse people, someone who served in a non profit in Africa, someone who is a DJ, someone who served in the military etc. When one sits and shares experiences with such people, one is bound to get a better and well rounded learning experience. This is the approach that the ISB seems to be following. It is all about the work experience, and how one has shown a record of leadership over time. If someone does not have work experience, how do you assess their leadership ability?

I know that the IIMs are hard to get into. But I also fear that if a great businessman like Bill Gates applied to the IIMs, he would be rejected if he only made an 80th percentile on the CAT. So basically, the IIMs are choosing the brightest minds, not the best ones suited for the purpose. I guess they are doing a great job considering that they have to choose between millions of applicants. But just because it is more selective than the ISB does not mean it is better.

Advantages of work-ex being told by a 19 year old who does not know how a company actually looks like.
LOL

Addy,
Just because you are studying abroad doesnt mean people out here will start listening to you.I don't think people out here in PG still have a colonialistic hangover. All said and done, you might not even pursue MBA.You might even discover some day that you have a different interest. You are just in 2nd yr of engg.Chillax......

[AddyJ]

@ Krishsuraj

I am not surprised that you are going to an IIM too. As I said earlier, I have nothing against it, but you are just confirming that IIM people like to make personal comments. Dude, if you disagree, make your point, don't start pointing fingers at me.

I have no clue who gave you the idea that I am an engineering student. I am a third year business student. If I were in India, I would be completing my BBA right now. Even now, I am in one of the most reputed business programs in the world, something I take pride in.

Secondly, you have no clue about my knowledge of companies and how they work. Desi Guru pointed out correctly that studying in the States needs a LOT of money. Why I am able to study in the US is because fortunately, my dad has that kind of money. He runs his own company in Delhi and hires and fires MBAs. All through high school, I have spent summers in his office and the manufacturing floor. I was discussing the stock market watching CNBC TV-18 with him when you were in your crib! I have visited his partner companies around the world. Sure, this 19 year old guy doesn't know how companies work.

If you want to make personal comments and make this game look ugly, that is your choice. I don't generally like to post angrily or sound immodest, but as far as I am concerned, I am requesting you to not to bring out the worst in me, and also not to give the IIM students a bad name.

@DG,

Thanks for your welcome! And thanks for praising my facility in writing. This is what constant preparation for the SAT does to one. Also, my time in an English speaking country has really helped.

Actually, talking of the SAT, I would like to point out that I am also beginning to prepare for the GMAT. Harvard and Stanford take about 2% of their applicants without any work experience. I am trying to be one those overachievers. Since you have done the CAT, what are your suggestions and tips? I do not have the most solid background in Math.

[krishsuraj]

Originally Posted by AddyJ

@ Krishsuraj

I am not surprised that you are going to an IIM too. As I said earlier, I have nothing against it, but you are just confirming that IIM people like to make personal comments. Dude, if you disagree, make your point, don't start pointing fingers at me.

I have no clue who gave you the idea that I am an engineering student. I am a third year business student. If I were in India, I would be completing my BBA right now. Even now, I am in one of the most reputed business programs in the world, something I take pride in.

Secondly, you have no clue about my knowledge of companies and how they work. Desi Guru pointed out correctly that studying in the States needs a LOT of money. Why I am able to study in the US is because fortunately, my dad has that kind of money. He runs his own company in Delhi and hires and fires MBAs. All through high school, I have spent summers in his office and the manufacturing floor. I was discussing the stock market watching CNBC TV-18 with him when you were in your crib! I have visited his partner companies around the world. Sure, this 19 year old guy doesn't know how companies work.

If you want to make personal comments and make this game look ugly, that is your choice. I don't generally like to post angrily or sound immodest, but as far as I am concerned, I am requesting you to not to bring out the worst in me, and also not to give the IIM students a bad name.

@Addy
Kids from families who run business tend to think that they have seen it all.I knew this was coming.You might have seen it all by visiting your father's company often. But you have never experienced it which people over here have experienced.I'm quite sure you have courses like 'Organizational Behavior' in ur UG. To understand what they actually mean, you should have 'worked' in a company yourself.How much ever you try putting your experiences in your father's company in glorified words,the fact is you are still 19 and you don't have any 'Valid' Work experience.

In one of your posts, you had quoted the following:-

"The M.B.A. candidate with zero experience is basically still a kid," says John Paul Komasinski, a survey respondent and CEO of Komasinski Business Solutions, a marketing and technology consulting firm. "Management requires very special people skills, attention to details, organization and coolness under fire. None of these qualities is apparent in a green M.B.A. student."

On one hand you say that ISB scores over IIMs because they emphasize more on work-ex. On the other hand you are doing a Management education in your UG.

If you require work experience for MBA,then what is the use of doing BBA or whatever you're doing right after School?You talk about the virtues of work-ex in Management Education and you have ended up with a career choice which is contradicting your own point of view!!!!! Do you think spending some time in your father's company and following stocks on CNBC has given you enough experience to pursue a Management education?
This clearly shows how clear your ideas on Management Education are.

You talk as if you were part of the Business meetings your father had with the foreign clients!!!!! You still have not learnt the art of putting your point across without offending others and you are doing a Business Management course in your UG??:


If you feel these remarks are personal, I feel talking derogatorily about IIM students is also a form of personal attack. After all I'm also one among them.Why do you consider yourself an authority to certify the quality of IIM students?

More and more I read such posts from you, your immaturity tends to get highlighted.I have no interest in having a duel with a kid who thinks he is an 'over Achiever'

P.S:- I have nothing against ISB and I personally feel comparing ISB and IIMs is not fair as they cater to different sets of people.

regards
Suraj

[libocta]

Originally Posted by AddyJ

......... but you are just confirming that IIM people like to make personal comments. ...............

wow! I'm really amazed by ur logical reasoning! SPOT ON dude...
IIM guys wud love to get personal if u decide to do so.. u see we still belive in TIT4TAT!

Originally Posted by AddyJ

......... Even now, I am in one of the most reputed business programs in the world, something I take pride in...............

Gud!!! for Godsake stay there... sure u can start a tread on that somewhere and do some IIM bashing there! u'll have only ur TYPE of peopel there and so NO ONE will Oppose u!

Originally Posted by AddyJ

.........I was discussing the stock market watching CNBC TV-18 with him when you were in your crib! I have visited his partner companies around the world. ...............

a Born Genious! u r really a GIFT of GOd to this planet.. but how does that help the Lesser mortals like us here? ??:

[quote=AddyJ]......... I don't generally like to post angrily or sound immodest...............[/quote]
We all have seen that here!

Originally Posted by AddyJ

.........

Originally Posted by AddyJ

Since you have done the CAT, what are your suggestions and tips? I do not have the most solid background in Math.

Pls take the trouble to find some time OUT of this thread.. sure a born Genious like u can help himself!

Ok... Those were some responses.. now getting back to some BASICS!:
WHats ur real problem dude! I suggest u go thru the Psot 1 to posts till now on this thread and analyse what u have really done!
- u get on a FORUM where 90%+ of Junta is Aspiring to Crack CAT ... so obviously IIM is a little close to their heart; just like ur college will be probably to urs!..
So if u go Shitting around on this thread for all wrong reasons and expect ur Big brothers to condone that; u r SERIOUSLY MISTAKEN...
- If u were really that brilliant , u wud have found someplace for ur self here too.! but u can have the benefit of doubt about ur willingness to utilise the money at ur disposal!
- U have frens going to IIT... U know the Business world inside out.. u know all about B-Schools here.. STOP FARTING dude!
I hope u'll give some considering to the LITTLE grey matter gifted to folks here... We know to differentiate FACTS from FARTS!
- Since we have walked this planeta little longer than u, and also had the opportunity to see work done in some SMALLER palces ( smaller by thye standards of companies u have seen ) , we know what suits us better...

and FInally , ur language, ur style of beating in bush without LOGIC, Inability to counter FACTS/LOGIC says it all about u.. I need not add anything more...

It high time u invested ur valuable energy somewhere else.. need tips on that,PM me!
p.s. If u think AGAIN some IIM_GUY has decided to get perosnal with u, U R RIGHT!

[OpiumOfTheMasses]

fee fi fo fear..

Are those a mods foosteps I hear.

[ExpandingHorizon]

Take it easy guys. You dont need to get all heated up about every dingbat comment made against the IIMs.