[Varnicat]

Across the world there has been a major revival of nuclear power as a
clean energy alternative.
Countries like France now meet over 70% of their electricity demand
through nuclear power,substantially reducing their carbon emission .
If India goes for this N- Deal, it would give this form of power generation
the required boost,
But that's the one face of the coin. According to estimates imported
Nuclear power would cost 2-3 times the cost of power from thermal plants
and 1.5-2 times the cost from indigenous nuclear plants.
From this perspective i think it becomes more imperative for India to
become part of the proposed Iran- Pakistan-India gas pipeline which
the US has sought to undermine through the nuclear deal.
Import is absolutely not the option at the moment.
specially when our country is suffering from the pangs of economic crisis.
Government should decide upon their priorties & try to understand
the need of the hour.

[konqueror_vivek]

Originally Posted by the_egonomist

Vivek,

And yes, the point about USA being an international leader - following them because of the fear of them is not a good thing right? I mean, we give into the N-deal and before we know it,we have a military base here.

Doesnt make sense to me as to why we must appease a nation that is creating so much turmoil in this world.

Cheers.

Ego,

You just pointed a very valid point, US being an international leader - given it always had a big say when in all major world issues. When it comes to Global warming and pollution US has been a bigger fish polluting the pond.
Scientists Detail U.S. Role In Global Warming
The G8 meeting, however, will only end up with nations shouting against US, but nothing will happen eventually (US emits 4 times more harmful gases than China, on a per capita basis).
VOA News - G-8 Summit Highlights Disparities About Global Warming

India, presently, is not in a condition to bear sanctions from US and UN-bodies, given we are heavily dependent on them.
- US has the biggest stake {~27%} in Indian exports.
- US 's FII has biggest stake in Indian capital markets {~16%)
Nuclear deal in its present form will hamper India's Nuclear weapon program, but that can be scarificed, given we will get shoulder of a bigger nation, which could help, India strategically in the region.

Global warming and pollution is bigger issue, but unfortunately double standards by developed nations dosent help India, lets take it this way, India has to choose between bad and worse, I believe if would go for bad than worse (A personal opinion).

Cheers,

[archyta]

hey guys, in my opinion, the indian govt is looking to enhance the energy capacity of the country by signing this N-deal.....but we just might have to surrender our autonomy that way...If the US suggests it is a boon for energy hungry nation like India, then, thanks for the concern but no thanks..( i change my stand here as i cant support the idea of unusable nuclear waste). Do you know that a nuke plant called Cirus in India has been shut on the insistence of the US....Lets then, also learn from other players here.. China is developing light water nuclear reactors on thier own....v can do it too, but for the time being only on a research basis, jus to find the monetary and environmental viability of such an option. India can redirect its funds that it is otherwise gonna pledge to the N-deal into useful n promising energy sources:
1. Wind energy from floating windmills at the seas that r only anchored in the sea bed!...might sound ambitious but thats the way to go...dont ya think, optimisation follows the innovation n developmt process, not vice-versa...there r always high costs in the initial stages in every novel venture...acceptably so.
2. Solar energy, when used in atleast the towns n villages (where development is jus starting to take place, n hence easier to apply) to meet small scale requiremts.....there r tens of thousands of villages in india..n on a daily basis, they might jus provide them with much needed electricity which politicians fail to succesfully provide, even after being brought to power..
3. Country-wide regulation of waste managemt, to provide for inputs in innovative waste converting technology.
4. encourage research in promising avenues without limiting funds..R&D is the key to developmt.

India, on its part must remind US that to fix the climate situation,THEY r suppposed to mfr n-reactors in hundreds n get them started within a few 50 years... btw, their nuclear industry has been down n shut for a long time..still their ironical claims dont end....
V r here to discuss climate change solns, for the earth on the whole...so let those, who claim the benefits of nuke energy employ thm in their territory n still manage to save the planet...v on our part shd assiduously explore the promising avenues n still play a major role.
I shall end my argument with this piece of news... The US n a few rich european nations open shop in developing economies like ours n china's by constructing green n environmentally safe offices n factories. they claim to indirectly help in cutting emissions here....what the irony here is, that our govt and of china, look to make money by not regulating the indegeneous industry but the foreign ones alone, thereby not really caring to take any sound step to reduce overall industry emmissions. v also have a part to play...we share n affect the earth in the same way as they do...so it all boils down to taking the real responsibility...

[AlpeshChaudhari]

@all,
Lets put aside the political things, apart from those affect enviornments. Lets discuss the Enviornment & global warming, in current issue our point is Nuclear energy affecting our enviornment. Let's continue with that. :eh:

@Ego,
As far as encouraging & implementing renewable energy sources is concerned, we are on the same side. I know the research is stalled for lack of money. But investing now in research & then implenting it when it becomes fully functional (again the time frame is not know here) is very risky business.

With the growing business & increasing standards of living we need power. I know we need to cut down on the power that we all waste, but govt. can't sit waiting for us to learn. They have to go with the solution. We need to have a nuclear power instead of renewable energy source in the near future. Thats my point. Even I would be happy to see my house running on renewable energy supply after 30 years. :happy:

Well, yes, surely nuclear energy plant might hurt enviornment in case of accident. Also, the disposal is a big issue to ponder over. But looking at the demand of the power we need it.

In cities like Pune there is no loadshading at least on paper, but other places are in a poor state. My hometown has 6 hours of daily loadshaing & other villages, that I have heard of, have 12 hours of loadshading daily. We can't really afford that. A lot of things of the country depend on energy sources.

Of course, at the end our long term goal is to make/retain this place as green as possible & we should start investing more in research & making it possible to implent on the bigger level.

@archyta,
As I said we should rather must invest in renewable energy sources. But it might take a lot of time for innovation & making systems implented everywhere.

Till that time, we need some assured source of energy.

Let's forget what Developed nations profit from us. If we are getting what we want why to oppose it. The deal has to be profitable for both parties. Nor there would not be any deal, will there be ?

Regards.

[the_egonomist]

With the growing business & increasing standards of living we need power. I know we need to cut down on the power that we all waste, but govt. can't sit waiting for us to learn. They have to go with the solution. We need to have a nuclear power instead of renewable energy source in the near future. Thats my point. Even I would be happy to see my house running on renewable energy supply after 30 years. :happy:

The government can always stall growth for sometime or ensure that the population doesnt exceed the capacities. The population growth rate ensures that we will need N-deals ten times over in a few years. Again short term. We have to decide now - the economy or the environment. Economies can always be re built. And doesnt USA enforce all such crap on developing countries when they refuse to sign any protocols as to the environment purely because it would hurt their economy?

Well, yes, surely nuclear energy plant might hurt enviornment in case of accident. Also, the disposal is a big issue to ponder over. But looking at the demand of the power we need it.

That is the kind of reasoning that has landed us into trouble. We always figure that nature can take one more hit. And that happened with everything - petroleum, hunting, whaling, fishing, etc.

And to put things in perspective - the oil in your bike can ruin almost one lakh litres of water. Imagine the grief nuclear waste could have and would most definitely have.

In cities like Pune there is no loadshading at least on paper, but other places are in a poor state. My hometown has 6 hours of daily loadshaing & other villages, that I have heard of, have 12 hours of loadshading daily. We can't really afford that. A lot of things of the country depend on energy sources.

Let me ask you how many illegal connections exist? These connections are what cause shortfall in supply. Why not gauge properly as to what our exact requirements are? And we may be pleasantly suprised...

Let's forget what Developed nations profit from us. If we are getting what we want why to oppose it. The deal has to be profitable for both parties. Nor there would not be any deal, will there be ?

It is not just opposed because of the environment but all the implications - strategically, defensively and politically (domestic and international).

Cheers and Regards.

[bharathraj1]

I have a couple of questions to all you environmentalists here. To be frank i don't quite understand the Nuclear deal and its implications completely.

Karnataka, the state i live in, is heavily dependent on Thermal power. We have a thermal power plant in Bellari District that provides most of our power. the plant gets subsidy from the government which it uses to buy coal. but from the past few months, the government is so struggling to make ends meet, that its been giving a very small sum to this plant. the result is that the plant has shortage of cash to buy coal, and only 50% of the plant's net capacity is utilized. and thus we have power cuts for about 3-4 hours everyday. infact it could be much worse.

im sure there must be similar such problems in other states too. in such a situation isnt it advisable to shift to Nuclear power? although we need a lot of investment to make, isn't it going to be simple considering that most of the infrastructure is already setup? while there is the threat of nuclear waste contaminating the disposal area, isnt it a possibility to re-use this waste and thus increase the net-net efficiency?

while the renewable energy sources are the best, the amount that needs to be invested to generate a MW of power is way too high. and for India, with so many problems to address, can we really invest in renewable energy at this stage? isn't it better to think about them once our immediate problems are first addressed?

lot of questions, but infact they all can be covered in one single satisfactory answer



Bharath

[sreeraj11]

Superb lines by a famous environmentalist

Biological extinction has been a natural phenomena in geological history but the rate of extinction was probably one species every thousand years. Evolution causes populations to adapt to the ecological changes brought about by changing climates and the environment but some species may not possess the genetic diversity to withstand such changes. The sabretoothed cats of the Pleistocene preyed only on mastodon mammoths. The extinction of the prey led to the extinction of the predator. Dinosaurs crumbled under their own heavy and odd bodies. Over recent times, the rate of extinctions is rising at an alarming pace.

Source wealthywaste.com

[Varnicat]

Originally Posted by geek04

I know it is very serious topic. Few days ago, i watched Mr. Al Gore's Inconvenient Truth and understood that Global Warming is a matter of quick action. We seriously need to do something quickly so that our next generation should not abuse us that we have given them a polluted air to breathe and impure environment to leave.

We need to take action quickly. I do not know how and from where to start? How to motivate people to plant more and more trees?

I did a little contribution from my side. I have 20 acre of land in Punjab in my village. So, i planted 500 plants of Jamun (Indian Fruit, the tree gives a lot of shade and was of only Rs. 2 each) at the boundary field. But, no idea how and when it happened, a herd of Indian Bluebuck (Neelgai), ate all the precious plants. I am not going to quit and will do it again next year but this time with a fence.

What should we do?

Hai,
I totally agree with you.Agriculture in India is at a cross-roads.
There has been a recent revival in the sector particularly in
self-sufficiency of food grains which has also shown the trend of
diversification. But here again "Global Warming" plays a very
devilish role.
Even a 1 degree rise in surface temperature will see the nation's wheat
production drop by 4-5 million tonnes.
Small changes in temp.& rainfall can have a great impact on the quality
of fruits,vegetables & medicinal plants etc.
Government should reduce fragmentation & deterioration of forests,it
should promote afforestation & reforestation. It should increase public
and private investments for plantations enhance joint foresty
management.
Plantations should be done at degraded parts of land.This can be done
by management of "Problem soils" mainly Usar soils (Are the soils which
are unable to sustain a healthy plant growth) Its ph is 8.5.

[Varnicat]

Well the N-Deal is almost signed.Now what u puys have to say about this.
It will really help in tackling the problem of Global Warming???
What will be its impact on our countries infrastructure and enviornment?
Please do give ur comments.