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Wonders of World
Chit-Chat / Your Interests Talk about your interests, ambitions, obsessions. Make friends over common interests - soccer, poetry or rock bands. It's time to lay back and relax, you don't have to make sense.

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Re: Wonders of World - 05-07-2007, 04:28 PM

@ Surveyor of non-existent virtual "Indian" Renaissance -

This is not some hate agenda spilling over. The discussion is very much in context. The central theme is

Quote:
Yesterday i was arguing with my friends about the same thing,
should one vote for Taj mahal or not,
A says " I didnt see Taj why should I vote and waste my SMS, from which the telcos cash"
B says"As an Indian you vote for Taj, once it gets the wonder status then India will get more tourism"

I would like to know what Puys think about this, did any one vote, if then for what & why you voted ?
Since I am an Indian citizen and did not vote for The Taj Mahal,I thought I may very well explain why I did not vote for Taj Mahal. People here have discussed how the voting may be bogus or genuine, etc.
So I am well within my rights to comment on-

1. The aesthetics (as I perceive it) of the Kabar.
2.The history behind it.

Let me elaborate on these-

1.The building does not impress me.It is dirty from the inside (been told that.) and has never served any purpose.
The white domes remind me of the torso of a 150+ kg Gora sunbathing.
The sunlight was reflecting off his pale white skin and he was quite an attraction on the beach that day. I somehow did not enjoy the sight though some people exclaimed that this Gora was a marvel, a true wonder.

Some people liked the sight, some did not. Period.

2.The historical reason- If we are discussing the Wonders of The World and cant go into detail, then what is the use of a thread.
Or are we expecting posts such as-

* I voted for Taj. Because I like it. It is beautiful.
*I voted for Alhambara. Because I like it.It is beautiful.
*I voted for Kremlin.Because I like it.It is beautiful.

NO.Right?

Anyone who has any feedback on any of these structures is free to
discuss it here.

I have my own religious reasons for not liking the Taj Mahal. And this has nothing to do with Oak, teak or Mahogany. This is my opinion.And nobody can stop me from expressing it.

A beautiful (according to popular perception ) Nazi structure may be nominated for the next new wonders of the world. But Jews can raise their voice against the structure. Many Jews may remain silent. And many of them may indeed feel that the building is beautiful.They may even campaign for it and send multiple SMSs

So it is all a matter of opinion.Nobody can curtail my freedom of expression.

Dont tread on my toes.Just chill.


PS- Pagalguy is blocked in many offices. For what? spreading hatred? Or for spreading higher education??
Heard something about conflict of interest?

+Dont try to pollute the Taj corridor by trying to nip "The non-existent virtual "Indian" Renaissance" on this thread.






Last edited by maheshtk_21; 05-07-2007 at 04:49 PM.
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Re: Wonders of World - 05-07-2007, 05:21 PM

@ Renaissance Leader-
Quote:
Originally Posted by maheshtk_21 View Post
1.The building does not impress me.It is dirty from the inside (been told that.) and has never served any purpose.
The white domes remind me of the torso of a 150+ kg Gora sunbathing.
The sunlight was reflecting off his pale white skin and he was quite an attraction on the beach that day. I somehow did not enjoy the sight though some people exclaimed that this Gora was a marvel, a true wonder.
Some people liked the sight, some did not. Period.
You are one of those special people who can see what most others can't

Quote:
Originally Posted by maheshtk_21 View Post
2.The historical reason- If we are discussing the Wonders of The World and cant go into detail, then what is the use of a thread.
Dont tread on my toes.Just chill.
There can be only version of history as far as I know. My earlier posts on this thread will enable neutral observers of this thread form an opinion. That there are individuals who have a different version of history is something which I can't help
Quote:
Originally Posted by maheshtk_21 View Post
PS- Pagalguy is blocked in many offices. For what? spreading hatred? Or for spreading higher education??
Heard something about conflict of interest?
Are we not lucky to have a system that interested souls can browse whatever he/she wants? I am sure the posts laden with hate in this thread would have aroused enough curiosity among the users here and would have helped spread so called history.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maheshtk_21 View Post
+Dont try to pollute the Taj corridor by trying to nip "The non-existent virtual "Indian" Renaissance" on this thread.
Oh yes I am curious as to what the end result of the renaissance will be. Considering that the original proponents of renaissance have proved that all such talk is just GLIB and once in power they are no better than the morons who ruled this country for a fairly long period,I doubt if the end result of that thread will lead to some real renaissance :neutral:


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Re: Wonders of World - 05-07-2007, 05:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plumber View Post

Let me put the same questionto you: Whay are you desperate to get Taj Mahal selected as one of the 7 wonders of the world. It is past isn't it? Why wallow in past glories? Why waste time over a monument? Why not go forward?

Wow; so it's the IT managers who are equally ignorant of the real History and facts, who will decide what is credible and admissible in History? Do you know the real History of India has been supressed by leftist, psuedo-secularists, by terming it as "propoganda", and as "encouraging intolerance and hate"? Have a look at Conundrum thread. Do some independent research!!
Who is desperate to get Taj Mahal on the list. Not me. I just voted for it...(Hell...I didn't even vote...Just replied to a long chain mail with my name & location, don't even care if that would count as a vote)...and that's it...moved on...I don't care if it doesn't appear on the list...there may be more deserving monuments..So be it...

The point I contend is when you say, Taj Mahal is a symbol of Blood or whatever *facts* and *original history* you refer to.

Independent research? Pray, tell me what independent research you did to come to a conclusion - Did *you* dig up the earth under Taj and found Hindu Idols?
Conundrum thread? Huh...I'm no leftist or 'pseudo-secularist' (Fact is probably I hate the left more than you do)... So, I don't believe in whatever propoganda they make... I'm not even a rightist...So won't even take your POVs.



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Re: Wonders of World - 05-07-2007, 05:52 PM

call me partypooper but i think this wonder things is being overhyped & unnecessary.

What good it would do? Just attract a few more foreigners? who actually laugh at the pitiable condition that our country really is in.
Already there are few disputes regarding authenticity of Taj. ....

& now dont BS me by saying that im unpatriotic when i say that....nowadays if patriotism
is reduced to candlelighting, chain-mailing & supporting Taj ...God save our beloved country!??:

i think some1 must have taken care of what im tryna say on this thread.


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Re: Wonders of World - 05-07-2007, 06:17 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarshaRocks View Post
@ Renaissance Leader-
@ Don Quixote- Thanks for the imaginary title.


Quote:
You are one of those special people who can see what most others can't
U are one of those special people who can spot special people.

Quote:
There can be only version of history as far as I know. My earlier posts on this thread will enable neutral observers of this thread form an opinion.
I did not comment at anyone else or quote anybody.
If you have such great faith in the intelligence of the neutral observers, why did you not let my allegedly inflammatory remarks pass?
Why get into this chastising mode?

Quote:
That there are individuals who have a different version of history is something which I can't help
Then why create a debate and put your blinkers on display

Quote:
Are we not lucky to have a system that interested souls can browse whatever he/she wants? I am sure the posts laden with hate in this thread would have aroused enough curiosity among the users here and would have helped spread so called history.
????
I guess it was from the lucky interested soul "quarters" that gems such as
these emerged-

Quote:
Do you wish chop fingers (or more) of Show Jahan's decendants? Would you destroy the Taj and build a temple? (You should contact Mr. Advani for that ;-))
Are these sane ideas of retribution, even for the sake of whipping up rhetoric?
It was scarier than the analogy that preceded it.
I have passed any such comments.


Quote:
Oh yes I am curious as to what the end result of the renaissance will be. Considering that the original proponents of renaissance have proved that all such talk is just GLIB and once in power they are no better than the morons who ruled this country for a fairly long period,I doubt if the end result of that thread will lead to some real renaissance :neutral:
That shows the baggage u r carrying. You have thrown caution to the winds and started arguing against people rather than the posts.
So u were reading those posts all along and wondering how you could hop in? Then when you find me on this thread, you start bullying. Be objective in ur discussions.Or have u started fantasizing ur role in the Saga of saving the secular fabric of our society against the communal demons?

No luck. I stick to my post first post. I dont like the Taj mahal for the reasons I have provided.And I have voted for some other Wonders of the world.
There is no hatred in my post.

Or are you trying to suggest that nobody can dislike the Taj Mahal?Or the reasons have to be in harmony with whatever you suggest?

People like u can derail any discussion.Your modus operandi never fails.

Last post on the issue.So please dont subject me to further character assassination. Will respond through personal messages.





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Re: Wonders of World - 06-07-2007, 09:12 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by maheshtk_21 View Post
@ Don Quixote- Thanks for the imaginary title.
Be objective in ur discussions.Or have u started fantasizing ur role in the Saga of saving the secular fabric of our society against the communal demons?
Last post on the issue.So please dont subject me to further character assassination. Will respond through personal messages.
Well Mahesh ,my apologies for the name calling and also for being your character assasin:neutral:
My posts on the thread have been objective. I wish to know the truth behind Tajmahal and other monuments in this country. It is very much in context by your own admission.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plumber View Post
Taj Mahal is a corrupted version of Tejo mahalay. For more facts, and before you come out with a reply, head here:

Taj Mahal - A Hindu Temple-Palace
I guess the above link and the contents of the link have exposed a lot about the historian who believes that Taj Mahal is a Palace or whatever.
How is it that I have no replies to my quoted posts below. Has the author who posted that link adopted a strategy of shoot and scoot? Or is he using his cohorts to divert attention from the issue at hand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarshaRocks View Post
Plumber- That historian appears to be a "bee in his bonnet" in the words of the supreme court. There are other historians like him have different stories to disprove that someone else other than Shah Jahan built the tomb. Which story do we believe?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarshaRocks View Post
I did read a lot of the link that you sent. It just bad mouthes a religion and propogates a theory that cannot stand facts. There is no explanation for this hate mongering.What is the site's objective?
Purushottam Nagesh Oak - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A little reading of the history of Oak's history shows that he believes that Agra Red Fort is a Hindu Building and Christianity also emerged from Krishna-niti.
This is a little hard for any objective man to digest. Does plumber subscribe to the views of the historian in totality? Or has he cared to research only the Taj Mahal? Plumber,will you please come out in the open as to what credibility that historian has?

And I really couldn't care less if questioning such apparently absurd ideas is termed Leftist,Secularist or whatever one may call.

P.S: Not my last post on this thread. I cannot stand crap like christianity derives from Krishna-niti

P.P.S: Plumber if it is embarrassing for you to publicly admit that you follow such historians,we can always use PM/IM. Spare me the trouble of dealing with your cronies.


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Re: Wonders of World - 06-07-2007, 10:31 AM

The conversation seems to have heated up to extremities.
There may be many reasons one may give as to why Taj Mahal isn't really one of the seven wonders of the world. Like, it was built by Shah Jahan after Mumtaz died giving birth to her 14th child; when her body couldn't really bear so many pregnancies. Or Shah Jahan had killed all the male members of his family to ensure his throne etc..and we could just go on and on

Anyway this whole campaign of Indian Government to promote Taj as the wonder of the world is just one of those Indian mindsets which is to chase after western recognition. Does the government do anything to protect and maintain the Taj Mahal or any other monument for that matter?

In any case the Taj Mahal wasn't really a part of the wonders of the world in the first place. Only one of the six wonders of the world are still there, and that's the Pyramids of Giza in Egypt. We just made it up, that Taj Mahal is the seventh wonder of the world.


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Re: Wonders of World - 06-07-2007, 10:59 AM

I don't understand what's all the fuss abt finding the top 7 wonders of the modern world
People are fighting for votes among various monuments just like we have fights between various B schools when someone declares "latest" ranks

In a way it's great for the Tourism Industry and Media! For me, any old monument in any country is as precious as the Taj as it tells us about the past of where we live today!

Donate money in preserving the monuments rather than voting for a silly ranking


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Re: Wonders of World - 06-07-2007, 02:10 PM

Quote:
I guess the above link and the contents of the link have exposed a lot about the historian who believes that Taj Mahal is a Palace or whatever.
How is it that I have no replies to my quoted posts below. Has the author who posted that link adopted a strategy of shoot and scoot? Or is he using his cohorts to divert attention from the issue at hand.
Firstly, I had given the link only to the Taj-Mahal related content of the site. I have not even bothered to see what else is there on the site. My only objective was to give info on PN Oak's theory on Taj Mahal. I had read about it couple of years back, google searched and that was the site that I came across. I do not vouch for whatever else the site has. In fact, I am yet to even read that properly.

Secondly, what's the big deal about it? Had I posted the Taj-Mahal theory from other site- and it is indeed available on many- would that relly affect the plausibility of the theory?

Lastly, more importantly, there are many others who have a similar theory on Taj. Have a look at this site:

Was the Taj Mahal A Vedic Temple


Quote:
..
Purushottam Nagesh Oak - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A little reading of the history of Oak's history shows that he believes that Agra Red Fort is a Hindu Building and Christianity also emerged from Krishna-niti.
This is a little hard for any objective man to digest. Does plumber subscribe to the views of the historian in totality? Or has he cared to research only the Taj Mahal? Plumber,will you please come out in the open as to what credibility that historian has?
Well, if indeed you proclaim yourself to be an "objective" person, you must really understand that just because I endorse someone's pov/theory on an issue, doesn't mean I endorse all his theories/povs.

As far as credibility of historian is concerned...please show me how many people have bothered to provide rebuttal to Oak's theories. Even Stephen knapp has endorsed/propounded Oak's theories...How many people who disagree with them have bothered to answer their contention?

All they do is resort to some vicious name-calling...Something which even the posters here have done.

Quote:
P.P.S: Plumber if it is embarrassing for you to publicly admit that you follow such historians,we can always use PM/IM. Spare me the trouble of dealing with your cronies.
Embarassing? All you have done, again, is attack the historian in question. You can't do better, can you?

As far as your point of 'cronies' is concerned, if you think sharing similar/same opinions with someone/thanking someone's posts is considered 'cronyism', the forum has 2 set of cronies:

a- sackhim Jihadists
b- sachin fans


By your own logic, you are my cronie as well. And the people who have thanked/seconded your p.o.v are your cronies. And since, you have thanked almost all the posts on this thread, except a few people's, you are a cronie of all of them.

On a more serious note, learn to keep the discussion focussed on issues/arguments. Stop resorting to name-calling, regardless of whether you endorse/refute someone's posts. You are free to disagree with my arguments, and rip them apart, if you can/want to.

It's below my dignity to cast such imprecations. Honestly!

Quote:
Who is desperate to get Taj Mahal on the list. Not me. I just voted for it...(Hell...I didn't even vote...Just replied to a long chain mail with my name & location, don't even care if that would count as a vote)...and that's it...moved on...I don't care if it doesn't appear on the list...there may be more deserving monuments..So be it...

The point I contend is when you say, Taj Mahal is a symbol of Blood or whatever *facts* and *original history* you refer to.

Independent research? Pray, tell me what independent research you did to come to a conclusion - Did *you* dig up the earth under Taj and found Hindu Idols?
There are 2 types of research.

Primary Research: Where one collects data first-hand, specifically for the issue at hand.

Secondary Research: where one uses sources like History textbooks/Magazines/internet and uses the data that's already been collected for same/different purpose.

Digging the monument would fall into 'a'. By research I meant, doing 'b'. Had I known you will misunderstand it, I would have specified it my initial post itself.

And, you said, you believe that it was a "monument of Love"; let me ask you: Did Mumtaz came and inform you that it was indeed a monument of love. Did Shahjan appear in your dreams and tell you that it was a 'monument of Love'? Or is it that you confidently believe that it's a 'monument of Love' because you have went and digged-up the monument and have spoken to Mumtaz' corpus?

If you indeed are so skeptical of History, start being consistently skeptical. What applies to goose, applies to gander. If you are fine with believing that it was a 'monument of Love', on the basis of secondary theories, I am allowed to believe in a version of History that goes against your beliefs, on the basis of secondary reserach, without having to justify my belief by digging up the monument.

Cheers!


PS: Shall abstain from posting if flaming and name-calling continues, and do not expect me to give instant replies to your posts. Also, people are requested to stop thanking/seconding my points, even if they honestly identify with them, lest they wanna get accused of being my 'cronies'.

PPS: I have always believed my arguments aren't infallible. They should be subjected to as much scrutiny as any one else's arguments are.

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Re: Wonders of World - 06-07-2007, 02:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plumber View Post
PPS: I have always believed my arguments aren't infallible. They should be subjected to as much scrutiny as any one else's arguments are.
Thanks


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