[Derrida]

What a non sense, pathetic, ridiculous thread!!! Nothing but hypocrisy, and well rehearsed rhetorics!!!

Had anyone without those fancy titles had started this thread with the link, the thread would have been closed long back by the admins asking for valid evidence, research, objective behind the post, relevance to CAT/MBA etc. But this thread? ....this will prosper as Mr Editor feels very strongly about the degrading culture in B-schools which is co-incidentally funded by the taxpayers. Hillariously ridiculous(?) thread and really doesn't merit any response. Ideally no one should post on this thread and the Mr Fancy Titles would know that just because one happens to write well, you can not write any crap and expect people to feel the way you do.

Swearing in B-school and for that matter anywhere is a non-issuse AFAIC, the real issue is : Is posting such an article on PG suitable? Everything I'd like to say has already been said and would like the admins to just go through the previous pages and think with a clear mind if there is any rationale in keeping this thread alive?

@Apurv: Its another mistake after the episodes with MvB and Plumber, and please close the thread and remove the article from the homepage. I expected better from PG and you.

[DJK]

I am sincerely disappointed in people for two reasons

1)Those who argue that this kind of behaviour is acceptable because it happens everywhere: Graft happens everywhere too, does that make it acceptable? Cheating in examinations happen in institutions across the world. Does that make it fair? Are you saying that IIMs should be subject to the same standards as all other engineering institutes or non engineering institutes? It's one thing to use such foul language in the company of friends and quite another to use it against strangers who are going to compete with you, in the name of strategy. How is that ACCEPTABLE?!! This "chaltha hai" attitude was expected considering most of it comes from Bschoolers and wannabe MBAS. But I thought there'd be more people condemning than condoning it. Considering the kind of rigorous selection procedures these hallowed institutes put MBA aspirants through, they had me believe, the ones who made it through were of a higher caliber, class and dignity than the rest. The ones who wouldn't have to resort to name calling and hurling abuses as "strategy" to intimidate their competitors. The ones who knew how to have fun without having to be embarassed about their behaviour later. I suppose, it was all an eyewash then.
Something to be said about expletives being great levellers?

2)People who call this a cheap marketing gimmick:I have seen posts by "old timers" claiming that this is something done to increase hits so to speak. I'll have you know that PG could do a lot if "clicks" were their criteria. They are sitting on goldmines of information that could be used irresponsibly, in order to generate more interest and hype. If you old timers whose names I'd rather not mention, think that PG competes to be like Aaj Tak or have resorted to yellow journalism, I'd say you are a bigger disappointment than you purport PG to be. For you have not understood the ethos that PG works by, which is a crying shame considering how long you have been around. Maybe you should honestly sit back and think how much PG would stand to gain and how much more it would stand to lose if it was indeed a marketing "strategy". PG values its people its members as its most important resource. Would you honestly say that PG would want to put that at risk, recklessly, without evaluating the consequences of posting this video? If your answer is still yes, I respectfully acknowledge that those who chose to leave PG in the name of this incident did the right thing not just for themselves but PG too.

Here's something for the sake of political correctness. The views expressed in the post are that of the author alone and do not reflect the opinions of the administrators or moderators of Pagalguy.com. Happy?

[live_n_let_live99]

A fine reply by Apurv...Agree with him on most issues...As I said yesterday itself, no amount of justification can hold water when it comes to crass of the kind that we've seen in the video...Moreover, I'm completely with Mr. Editor as far as the wastage of taxpayers money is concerned...Far too often, almost everything (negative) associated with a B-School gets buried under the garb of high salaries that are doled out...Yeah, consulting and I.Banking placements are important but at the cost of sounding a person from the Black and White era, I'd still like to believe there is life beyond numbers...Oh btw, I've worked in the Corporate Sector and I exactly know what the reality is as well...My views, despite all that...

One thing though that still deserve an appropriate answer...Why these lines in your opening post? As rightly pointed out by amitnsitian, there are too many ugly things that happen out there that thankfully (or atleast hopefully) dont happen out here...Surely, we cant be smitten by the 'All thats West is BEST' syndrome...

Originally Posted by Apurv

Can these campuses ever compete with Harvard and Oxfords of the world?

Finally, I hope we do get a statement from the Director at JOKA on this...The one thing thats common with the AajTaks and the India TVs is that in almost every case that they pick up, little or no 'follow up' is done...Some of their intentions could even be noble, heck...But the fact that nothing seems to come out of it makes us believe that all thats done to merely up their TRPs...The one thing that PG.com can do out here is to ensure that this thread doesnt end up getting lost in a few days time...

You said that:

Originally Posted by Apurv

We spoke to IIM Calcutta's Dean of Programmes and Initiatives Prof Saibal Chattopadhyaya, who chose to distance himself from the video and seemed more concerned if the video was uploaded from IIM Calcutta servers. Asked if he was worried about what he saw in the video and had subsequent concerns about the campus culture within IIM Calcutta, he said, "I have to verify first if these students (in the video) are indeed ours but until then I can't say anything."

It would be great to see what his reaction will be to the kind of responses we've seen on this thread; wherein some of his own students have gone on to claim and say quite emphatically that 'All this is fine'...Surely, he has to issue a statement...

But yes, in case no 'follow up' is done and if this indeed ends up getting buried, then most of us would be left with no choice but to believe that, even PG.com for once, was thinking of somehow getting more hits than anything else...

[milindagrawal]

Glued to this thread for the last 1 hr...


Guys just one thing... Is there any point discussing something that concluded at some annual sports meet decades ago??
Sincerely hope this 'Senstional Video' doesn't take over the euphoria of the Premier League..
Moi off from this thread... As I never preferred AajTak/IndiaTV etc..

@Mods :At least NOW the video should be removed from PG Homepage. Even if you all are so hell bent on discussing the 'rights and wrongs', this thread is sufficient to satiate.

[The Raven]

I think it is more an isue of general rot in the society than an individual issue of institutes. And the reactions to this by the institute are not going to be positive. If this had happened at my institute the authorities would have put an end to the sports fest. I don't know if PG expects that kind of knee jerk reactions.

Let me give an example of the rot in the society. I was writing my CBSE exam in 1997. One of my classmates actually dared to ask the external invigilator to get him the class topper's paper for cogging. The man actually went and asked the topper and when he refused , the invigilator gave him a look that kind of said " Why are you selfish?". So when coming to B-Schools that places a premium on academic honesty, students actually are genuinely confused and get into serious trouble.

Same with this issue. These kind of words and behaviour have become part of youth culture. So if one institute enforces different rules, youngsters are going to be confused. IF PG wants to bring a fundamental change in culture, they have to start from home. Someone mentioned people indulge in milder versions of this kind of behaviour in AIPGMs. This should be discouraged . Also there should be no alcohol at such meets as such behaviour goes hand in hand with drinking. Is PG ready for this?

One set of people affected by this kind of culture is a a small silent minority who are uncomfortable with this kind of behaviour. They get cut off from the majority. It happened to me during my engineering. So I never really related properly to the majority of my engineering batch mates. However over the years I opened my mind to this kind of culture and that helped me integrate better with people of my age group at software company and B-school. So as an individual it is best to adopt oneself to this kind of culture - Not indulging in it oneself too zealously but not condemning people who indulge in such behaviour. And as a society we should seek to bring about a fundamental change right at school level.

[freestyle]

This sort of sledging happens all the time in Inter-IIT sports meets, and for that matter, in sports meets between other B-schools just as well. I was appalled the first time I came across this sort of ‘sledging’, but I’ve just seen it so often, I am no longer surprised.

There again, in the inter-IIT sports meets, we got the same responses of ‘campus culture’, ‘rivalry’ and ‘tradition’. So when one young man lowered his shorts and waded amid a group of women, people said nothing. When one guy got beaten up by what I can only call a mob – silence again. To think these events are supposed to bring institutes together.

Sure, all this hasn’t happened in B-school events yet, but let’s keep looking the other way and soon enough, it’ll arrive. Or maybe it all happens anyway, and we just choose not to talk about it. The fact that Apurv mentions the women who’ve have written in to PG all along seems to affirm that.

What’s tasteless to me might be normal conversation for you – maybe you greet your parents with incestuous appellations and are okay with it. Good for you. Please indulge yourself – but don’t inflict yourself upon people who don’t share your idea of fun. Or suggest that because you enjoy it, everybody else should too. This isnt about policing you or telling you what to do, but about telling you that people arent comfortable with what's on.

Sure, people swear all the time. People insult each other in every college. What does trouble me is that it seems institutionalized here – two of the institutes I’ve been in have practiced this systematically. Besides, just because crassness happens doesn’t mean it’s okay, or that everyone is comfortable with it.

Btw, profootball, I don’t quite agree when you say IIMK-IIMB meets have no such issues. There is a fair amount of the same kind of ‘sledging’ that is on there too.

I’ve seen this sort of venom often enough to agree with Apurv when he says this is a bigger problem than just two institutes indulging in friendly banter.

I’m glad PG brought this up. At least we’re talking about it, it’s out in the open. We’re discussing it, instead of brushing it under the carpet and pretending that all’s well.

[estranged_gnrs]

Originally Posted by The Raven

IIF PG wants to bring a fundamental change in culture, they have to start from home. Someone mentioned people indulge in milder versions of this kind of behaviour in AIPGMs. This should be discouraged . Also there should be no alcohol at such meets as such behaviour goes hand in hand with drinking. Is PG ready for this?

Yes. I apologized on the AIPGM thread and committed that care will be taken to ensure a better interaction in the future AIPGMs. Apurv has also mentioned this in his previous post. There was no knee jerk reaction from our side. We accepted the feedback and apologized for hurting sensitivities of anyone present at AIPGM and we will make sure everyone enjoys in a healthy way. But nothing can be taken back from the excellent work done by the volunteers from Bangalore for the event.

Things happen all the time, but it is our choice to take the feedback and try to make a change, rather than have "chalta hai " attitude and accept mediocrity just because it is prevalent.

Cheers,
Rohit

[akc123]

smacks of vendetta...nothing else...
i guess Mr.A had been rejected by iimc or xl....!!! :new_ukliam2:

and to all those who are pretending to be SAINTS...cmon..u r the biggets hypocrites...

if the girls in the video do not have any problems ..who are you to comment upon them...!!
in other words..dont try to become a mahatma gandhi !! cuz we dont need one....

:2gunfire:

[pendyal]

Originally Posted by ismbaneeded

My only request is to not associate this with IIM name tag. This is specific to IIMC. Not with any other IIM.

Regards,
ismbaneeded

well dood, since u have posted twice saying that such stuff is specific to IIMC and no other IIM, i would like to point out some stuff to you from our very own campus (am assuming u r from A):

• firstly, since u have been on campus for some time, u shud be knowing abt the "Top 5" tradition of most dorms. i dont think it is something to be proud of.....personally it is worse than what the video here shows.

for those who are not from IIMA and wouldnt know, here is a desrciption of the event:
within IIMA, the student community is divided into dorms. now each dorm has its own traditions. but something that is common to all the dorms are the birthday parties where the birthday boy/girl has to choose a guest of honor of the opposite sex, who will then smear the birthday boy's/girl's face with cake.
after all this there are snacks and then shouts of "kat lo" start to echo in the dorm asking all non-dormies to leave. (what follows was true in my dorm with friends from other dorms saying similar stuff happens).
then we have something called a top 5, where the birthday boy has to list 5 gilrs from his batch and three from the senior/junior batch (depending on if he is a junior/senior) in his order of preference. he then has to describe in detail and vividly how he is going to have sexual intercourse with the 5 girls he has nominated to be in his top 5 (the 3 girls from the other batch are spared). initially, it is quite shocking for a lot of the fachchas who do it/see it for the first time. but they are forced to sit thru it in the name of dorm tradition. and once they sit thru 2 or 3 top 5's they also start to enjoy it...much like starting to smoke or drink. it kind of becomes an addiction. i dont know if it goes on in the girls' dorms as personally i wudnt have the guts to discuss such things with a girl, however close i was with any of them.

• secondly, before we take the moral high ground abt ethics and stuff, i would like to point out an incident a few years back where office bearers of the student body bribed fellow students/juniors in a b-school event to lose, so that the team in question could go on and win the best team of the event prize.

[akc123]

Originally Posted by pendyal

well dood, since u have posted twice saying that such stuff is specific to IIMC and no other IIM, i would like to point out some stuff to you from our very own campus (am assuming u r from A):

• firstly, since u have been on campus for some time, u shud be knowing abt the "Top 5" tradition of most dorms. i dont think it is something to be proud of.....personally it is worse than what the video here shows.

for those who are not from IIMA and wouldnt know, here is a desrciption of the event:
within IIMA, the student community is divided into dorms. now each dorm has its own traditions. but something that is common to all the dorms are the birthday parties where the birthday boy/girl has to choose a guest of honor of the opposite sex, who will then smear the birthday boy's/girl's face with cake.
after all this there are snacks and then shouts of "kat lo" start to echo in the dorm asking all non-dormies to leave. (what follows was true in my dorm with friends from other dorms saying similar stuff happens).
then we have something called a top 5, where the birthday boy has to list 5 gilrs from his batch and three from the senior/junior batch (depending on if he is a junior/senior) in his order of preference. he then has to describe in detail and vividly how he is going to have sexual intercourse with the 5 girls he has nominated to be in his top 5 (the 3 girls from the other batch are spared). initially, it is quite shocking for a lot of the fachchas who do it/see it for the first time. but they are forced to sit thru it in the name of dorm tradition. and once they sit thru 2 or 3 top 5's they also start to enjoy it...much like starting to smoke or drink. it kind of becomes an addiction. i dont know if it goes on in the girls' dorms as personally i wudnt have the guts to discuss such things with a girl, however close i was with any of them.

• secondly, before we take the moral high ground abt ethics and stuff, i would like to point out an incident a few years back where office bearers of the student body bribed fellow students/juniors in a b-school event to lose, so that the team in question could go on and win the best team of the event prize.

Mr. A**** and ADMINISTRATORS

Why dont u put this article concerning IIMA on first page ...then you go for all the other IIMs...then you go after the IITs...then....who knows wat?? maybe he will go after cleaning the Harvards...MIT...Stanford...blah blah
maybe then u will have taken peace with the B-school world after cleansing it of its sins........

CHEAP PUBLICITY STUNT BY PG !!!
IIMs STAND where they are...No need of an endorsement from a Pagalguy to prove its mettle....