What makes you to give oversmart statements ? Where you stand at this juncture in specialised finance field? Are you a CFA AIMR charterholder? Are you a investment banker on wall street ? Are you a ICFAI vice chancellor where you know the university and its courses and pen down fatuous words.

oversmart statements? you said icfai cfa was wider in scope than aimr cfa coz it had 32 exams instead of 3. The logical flaw there was that having more exams doesn`t mean it`s more difficult or more vast than aimr. You can cover 10 times the scope in one exam, or you can cover one tenth of the syllabus and hold 50 exams. the number of exams is no measure of the vastness or complexity of the course...as simple as that! a kid could have spotted that flaw...i dont need to be a charterholder or a phd to point it out! Common sense, watson!


What do you think about CFA AIMR. Are you thinking you will clear june 2006 level 1, then pass level 2 in june 2007 and finally bang level 3 in june 2008? Registering in mid february for june examinations and that too with a non commerce background -Is that making you oversmart and

Nope, i`m thinking i`ll clear level 1 in june. if that doesn`t work out then i`ll take it again in december. Then i`ll apply to US b schools and go for an mba in fall 2007. then i`ll graduate and clear level 2 after my mba. depending on my careeer progression, i`ll decide if i wanna go for level 3 or not. Then i`ll work for a hedge fund or be a sell side analyst. I might even get married around that time...i plan to have 4 kids-1 boy, twin girls, and then again a boy. i`ll start by living in an appartment, and then move to an independent house in Sunville, CA. I also plan to keep 2 dogs, one of them will be called Jasper, the other name i havnt decided yet. There`ll also be a boat, we`ll call that "Rahi". When i and my girl have enough money in our accounts, we`ll come back and start a school in india. i plan to die in my native place, a small village in north india.
Since you seem like the type that likes to get personal and poke his nose into other ppl`s personal plans, i thought it`d be a god idea for me to put all my personal plans into one place where you can come back and refer to anytime you feel like.


you are behaving like a leader in CIIA, CFA ICFAI and CFA AIMR threads?

Who said i was a leader? Ppl post questions on pg, and whoever has the answers, posts them! If posting the maximum number of responses makes me a leader, then heck yeah, i`m a leader....SUE ME!


You might have increased India's current account deficit balance by transferring Indian currency in foreign account but we are not here to read misleading, irrational, repungance,bad purport discussions.

Dont worry, when i move to the US, i`ll be sending back dollars to my folks here. Give me the address of your kirana shop and i`ll ask them to buy grosseries exclusively from your shop! that should tilt the balance in india`s favour, much to your relief!:grab:



We are here to make thoughtful judgements based on well researched data, strategic thinking and limpid language depicting 0% imperiousness.
Perspicacious words

do you realize you`re making a fool of yourself by putting on this fake lingo? You sound like you`ve taken the gre a million times! You know the words, but you dont know when and how to use them! you`re the typical wordlist jackass. Anyways, get your basic grammar right, and then use these words.
examples:
Are you thinking you will clear june 2006 level 1
corrrect: Do you think you will clear level 1 in June 2006.

"Chartered finaicial analysis" from ICFAI
get the name of the degree right. it`s not "Analysis", it`s "analyst"

Quite a lot of subject verb agreement errors too! work on that.
So much about "limpid language" huh!


Anyways, this thread has lost direction. It was meant to discuss something else...and all that`s going on here is emotional bullshit and pointless rhetoric. I dont intend to waste anymore time on this thread.

What experience do you have of financial industry? how much time have you spent in a financial institution to make such "value-based" judgments about different courses? how well do you know the way institutions work ? Do you even know what these courses Indian CFA and CIIA are like doing actually ? Nothing of it I am sure....and yet, here is a engineer trying to tell the world that the world is black just coz hes worn black glasses !!
Tumtum.

this is so typical of you...getting worked up and emotional about everything, and missing the point completely in the process! anyways, i was expecting this from you, and of course, from your ardent follower..babu ("we must all be proud of tum tum" etc etc...is it just you with another id?!!)

Do i have to work in an investment bank to raise a doubt about how 11 languages is the biggest advantage of some course?? Does it matter to me as an indian student whether people in iran and turkey have finally found a course that will suit their language requirements? I'm a consumer looking for finance courses, and aciia is the seller selling a finance course. They produce a course and they advertise it saying it`s biggest advantage is that it is offered in 11 different languages. and i`m like...duh, so how is it an advantage to me?? i live in an english speaking country (for all business purposes, we`re an english speaking country), i intend to work in an english environment, so what do i care whether it is offered in a zillion different languages?? And that is the point, which youcompletely missed. Think about how a course, or any product for that matter, benefits YOU. Do you think if someone did the ciia in urdu, he`s gonna be placed in merrill lynch in wall street?? no, he`ll work in a local firm in his home country. He lives there, he studies there in his own language, he works there, he dies there. How did his getting a ciia in xyz language increase the worth of either ciia or inprove my chances of finading a job with a ciia degree?? in fact, offering a course in regional language is only gonna make professionals less mobile...their sphere of operation wil be restricted to their home country. Just answer this simple questions: how does a turkish guy getting a ciia in his native language benefit ME, THE END USER OF CIIA?

abhi bolo, what`s wrong with the above statements? Try restricting your replies to the context of what i say, and not bring out your frustrations with the rest of the world and your life reflect into your posts....unless you wanna get a piece of my mind, that is.

PS: there is nothing called the "Indian cfa". CFA is a registered trademarrk of cfa institute, and no one but the owner of that trademark is allowed to use it for commercial purposes. you see that little circle with an "R" on top of the word CFA whenever it appears anywhere? yeah, that means, it`s usage is restricted...and creating of local flavours is illegal. Ever heard of an "indian Nike"? nahi na? Think about it...you`re violating the very code of ethics that you blindly memorized and passed the cfa which you`re so proud about!

How can you make such a irrational statement when you do not have a slightest idea about CFA ICFAI. Do you know why did the split up happened between AIMR and ICFAI? I mentioned it before. It was because ICFAI wanted a broader coverage.

Have you studied ICFAI books? Do you know on an average every year 160 guys become CFA ICFAI out of 20000 studying at various levels. Have you solved questions in ICFAI workbook?

What makes you to give oversmart statements ? Where you stand at this juncture in specialised finance field? Are you a CFA AIMR charterholder? Are you a investment banker on wall street ? Are you a ICFAI vice chancellor where you know the university and its courses and pen down fatuous words.

What do you think about CFA AIMR. Are you thinking you will clear june 2006 level 1, then pass level 2 in june 2007 and finally bang level 3 in june 2008? Registering in mid february for june examinations and that too with a non commerce background -Is that making you oversmart and you are behaving like a leader in CIIA, CFA ICFAI and CFA AIMR threads?

You might have increased India's current account deficit balance by transferring Indian currency in foreign account but we are not here to read misleading, irrational, repungance,bad purport discussions.

We are here to make thoughtful judgements based on well researched data, strategic thinking and limpid language depicting 0% imperiousness.

Perspicacious words !!

well said dude their are many people around who make comments abt anything without any clue about tht thing

Having 32 exams doesn`t necessarily mean that it`s wider. You could split up ICFAI's 32 exams into 3200 baby exams, would that make it any tougher? Lets face it, ICFAI and AIMR are two different roads leading up to the same destination...one is shorter than the other, and is therefore more risky. The other might be longer and harder, but it takes you there for sure. Done?!

How can you make such a irrational statement when you do not have a slightest idea about CFA ICFAI. Do you know why did the split up happened between AIMR and ICFAI? I mentioned it before. It was because ICFAI wanted a broader coverage.

Have you studied ICFAI books? Do you know on an average every year 160 guys become CFA ICFAI out of 20000 studying at various levels. Have you solved questions in ICFAI workbook?

What makes you to give oversmart statements ? Where you stand at this juncture in specialised finance field? Are you a CFA AIMR charterholder? Are you a investment banker on wall street ? Are you a ICFAI vice chancellor where you know the university and its courses and pen down fatuous words.

What do you think about CFA AIMR. Are you thinking you will clear june 2006 level 1, then pass level 2 in june 2007 and finally bang level 3 in june 2008? Registering in mid february for june examinations and that too with a non commerce background -Is that making you oversmart and you are behaving like a leader in CIIA, CFA ICFAI and CFA AIMR threads?

You might have increased India's current account deficit balance by transferring Indian currency in foreign account but we are not here to read misleading, irrational, repungance,bad purport discussions.

We are here to make thoughtful judgements based on well researched data, strategic thinking and limpid language depicting 0% imperiousness.

Perspicacious words !!

i`ve heard you mention this earlier as well...i found it quite odd then too. Why is CIIA's choice of 11 different languages it`s "biggest advantage"?? in fact, how is it an advantage to us at all??? It could work in favour of people in some european countries where ppl just cant speak english, but i dont see how it bothers us. Would you take the CIIA in tamil or telugu or marathi if it were offered in those languages? In any case, it is the English speaking world where the finance action is....even in non-english speaking countries, it is the well-educated (and hence english speaking) people who run the show. I really dont care if people in Iran or Turkey are joining the finance industry by learning finance in urdu or whatever language!

One should have the knowledge. If some body ask me details about CIIA, then i will mention its golden features. When you get in Investment banking, you might be focussing on oil, gas and transportation sectors but still you will keep knowledge about other sectors and index movements. If somebody is planning to register for CIIA, one should know the degree inside out.

We are english speaking country. But taking exams in 11 different languages is a big advantage to members like poland, thailand, china, france, russia, Germany,Hungary, Austria, belgium etc. This same advantage will make CIIA one of the most popular qualifications in the world by next decade giving nice competition to CFA AIMR.In case ,if you happen to clear all CFA AIMR levels, then dont worry. It will also be a respected qualification by that time.

Crash_test_dummy Says

I really dont care if people in Iran or Turkey are joining the finance industry by learning finance in urdu or whatever language!

lol....as if the whole world works as per what you care about and what you dont care about !!!

I dont know what basis you use to make such vile statements. what I figure out is that you have listened to some people and read a few pages from the web and made your judgements from it. What experience do you have of financial industry? how much time have you spent in a financial institution to make such "value-based" judgments about different courses? how well do you know the way institutions work ? Do you even know what these courses Indian CFA and CIIA are like doing actually ? Nothing of it I am sure....and yet, here is a engineer trying to tell the world that the world is black just coz hes worn black glasses !!

Looking at your comments, it seems that some people just "grow"......they never "grow up". Sick !!!

Regards,

Tumtum.

The biggest advantage for CIIA is papers are conducted in 11 languages but in CFA paper is only conducted in english. This means mass participitation for CIIA from non english countries.You can also take papers at different global test centers in case you are a mobile worker.

i`ve heard you mention this earlier as well...i found it quite odd then too. Why is CIIA's choice of 11 different languages it`s "biggest advantage"?? in fact, how is it an advantage to us at all??? It could work in favour of people in some european countries where ppl just cant speak english, but i dont see how it bothers us. Would you take the CIIA in tamil or telugu or marathi if it were offered in those languages? In any case, it is the English speaking world where the finance action is....even in non-english speaking countries, it is the well-educated (and hence english speaking) people who run the show. I really dont care if people in Iran or Turkey are joining the finance industry by learning finance in urdu or whatever language!

hey thanks Guttsm
does clearing the level 1 of CFA AIMR call for the exemption in CIIA?
what other options (apart from ICFAI) merit an exemption in CIIA exams??

No CFA level 1 does not grant any exemption for CIIA, switzerland

If you want exemption in CIIA, then you need to clear atleast CFA ICFAI level 2 exams. ICFAI is a contracting member in CIIA which is highest degree of membership just below founding members

You can join CIIA course and clear both national and international exams if you not willing to join ICFAI course

The biggest advantage for CIIA is papers are conducted in 11 languages but in CFA paper is only conducted in english. This means mass participitation for CIIA from non english countries.You can also take papers at different global test centers in case you are a mobile worker.

Second thing is CIIA makes you expert at local level money market , then makes you expert at international money market when you clear international exams.

do CIIA have any website?

aciia.org

sometimes typing this directly gives problems...in that case, type aciia.org in google and click the first result.

hey thanks Guttsm
does clearing the level 1 of CFA AIMR call for the exemption in CIIA?
what other options (apart from ICFAI) merit an exemption in CIIA exams??

U can do CIIA directly, but for that you need to have work ex and some other eligibility criteria, which u can see in the website.
Harsh

Well, officially, CIIA is only open to people with work ex, but ICFAI doesn`t implement this rule. They offer CIIA to anyone, even people in final year.

Hi Nakul,
ACIIA is Association of Certified International Investment Analysts.
www.aciia.org is the official website.

ICFAI University has established CPMR which is a member of ACIIA. The certification given by ACIIA is called CIIA.

ACIIA is established by ASAF and EFFAS (Associations for Financial and Investment Analysts in Asia and Europe respectively).
So, all students of member organisations of ASAF and EFFAS are given waivers in pursuing CIIA.
Since ICFAI represents India at the ASAF, so if we do CFA from ICFAI, we get waivers in CIIA. Also, we can start CIIA immediately after MS Finance (CFA).
U can do CIIA directly, but for that you need to have work ex and some other eligibility criteria, which u can see in the website.

Harsh

Hello,
One great thing is that after completing Level 2, You get waivers for CIIA (Certified International Investment Analyst), Switzerland for national exam. You can directly appear for CIIA international examination and this is a great Global degree in investment banking field.

do CIIA have any website?
have alook at this: http://www.cpmrindia.org/CPM_Program.htm
it seems that CIIA, CPMR, ICFAI all act in consortium.

Also found this: http://www.saa.or.jp/english/education/ciia-exam.html

If this is their official website, it looks lacklustre.

Also, if CIIA has international recognition (sorry, iam unaware, but wld like to know more abt it), cant it be pursued directly just as CFA AIMR (this needs no introduction). WHats all this funda abt Indian partner ICFAI n all???

The most easiest job in the world is to speak without Knowledge. This thread is classic example of this . Start an ICFAI thread and here comes our experts with half baked knowledge thrashing ICFAI

India needs private universities with global reach, advanced technology, updated courseware, awesome research. If India fails to set up these private universities, then all those 550 million youngsters who are under 25 will be doomed.

Most of the countries have some sort of financial analyst course which suits their domestic needs. in Japan, its called CMA, In Korea its called securities financial analyst etc. In India fortunatelyor unfortunately its called CFA. You do net get CFA directly, You get MS finance. Why you get MS finance-Because ICFAI is a deemed university. You get a CFA charter from CCFA (Council of chartered financial analyst) which is non profitable society registered under AP act, 1989.

Now one billion dollar question:

Why did ICFAI decided to keep its programme name CFA?

CFA AIMR and ICFAI were one and same thing. CFA AIMR wanted narrow focus on its course focussing on security analysis and portfolio management. ICFAI wanted a broader focus which means starting from basic concepts like jouranl entries, cash book, economics, stats to move on to equity courses. Hence partnership broke and ICFAI started its own CFA charter which is perfectly legal.

CA, MBA is not a trademark registered with one institute. Similarly CFA is only registered in US through AIMR. Study whole case on CFA institute website by entering India on search bar.

Guys who havent registered for CFA ICFAI because they fear they will not be able to complete the course are coming on this thread and thrashing ICFAI !!

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Jump to: navigation, search
ICFAI (Institute of Chartered Financial Analysts of India), headquartered in India at Hyderabad, Andhra Pradesh, is an educational institution which provides both campus and correspondence based learning.
It's MS(Finance) program leading to CFA Charter from CCFA, is widely respected and reputed in India
However, due to a 1998 law suit filed by AIMR, the CFA Charter from CCFA is prohibited from USA and Canada.


So, guys, CFA from ICFAI is recognized throughout the world except US and Canada. Also, a cousin of mine in Melbourne says that CFA from India is well known and respected in Australia and SE Asia.

This should rest doubts about the recognition of CFA frm ICFAI.

Well Routhmanz.......I have my own good experience with ICFAI and for your kind information, let me tell you that the threads you pointed out were from the years of yore buddy ! It pays to be updated....just visit ICFAI website, they now have approval from UNIVERSITIES GRANTS COMMISSION (UGC). Now they are an approved university....wake up !!!

As far as crash test dummy is concerned, I wil again say only one thing.....something I said earlier.....I am NOT against AIMR buddy......no ways....but just coz AIMR is damn good (which it is), it does not in any way mean ICFAI CFA is shit. It was, it is and will be a terrific degree and unfortunately u can't do anything about the quality of the course except accepting it. Regarding convincing others.....well if you read the post again, you will realize that I wasn't convincing....I just thought that I should separate the fact from rumours and substantiate it with my experience. My best wishes to crash test dummy for clearing AIMR CFA.....dont worry....that horrible dream you had is never gonna be true. All the Best.


Warm regards,

Tumtum.

Any body from delhi taking training classes for CFA ICFAI?

How are the training classes in general?

Oops. I started this thread to form a study group and help people studying ICFAI CFA to clear papers. This thread is in trouble

One thing which comes in my mind. If ICFAI is fraud, why did ACIIA , Switzerland tied with ICFAI and offered waivers to CFA ICFAI students?ACIIA, switzerland have tied with 22 regional bodies and offering CIIA across globe in 13 languages. ICFAI is one of them.

No one is hired because one is from IIM, or one have done CFA AIMR or have done CFA ICFAI. Interview happens with every candidate irrespective of his/her education accomplishments. Interview should be used as a strategic tool by a candidate to put across his/her point and move closer to coveted job offer.

Work hard. Slog hard. Stay positive. Getting a job or not is a tricky issue. Believe in god

kindly go through what others have to say about reputation if ICFAI.
i found it on wikipdeia-
and yes please go through the link- icfai students rue the day.there are hundreds of websites having similar view of ICFAI.
ICFAI
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jump to: navigation, search
ICFAI is a group of universities in India who claim to have permission to run courses all over the Country. Their problem is that as per the laws of the Country they are only allowed to give degrees in the states they are incorporated in. Sad for all the students who are being duped.It is omnipresent across India.
Read more on icfai students rue the day

Crash_test_dummy Says

Hey Mad, could you elaborate a little on that one? Sounds interesting!

I'd rather I not be quoted on this First up, i've never even looked at CFA or any other stuff....My experiences with that are mostly thro' my friends when i was @ icfai b-school in hyd..I've heard of pass percentages of 2-3% being dandied about Quite a few of my fin-o-holic friends had signed up initially for the course and had starry dreams that they would end up with a major in fin and a CFA and whatever other courses they had already done (quite a few fin guys at icfai were CAs or were in final stages of completing it)....Don't ask me how all of those varied courses fit in their thought process But I've seen most drop out after the alpha (? iirc, thats the first stage)...And by the time we passed out, it was just a fraction of the original that actually got thro' to their CFA.....The conspiracy theory I was referring to was about how the folks at icfai wanted ppl to talk/conspire/discuss about CFA by making sure very few ppl make the cut.....The shock & awe factor, if you will.....But like I said, almost all of this is hearsay...So take it with a pinch or bucket, if you will

You could split up ICFAI's 32 exams into 3200 baby exams, would that make it any tougher?

Hehe...Reminded me of the typical line that goes when one starts to write about Berkshire Hathaway's huge stock price and how most ppl dont realize that a stock split wouldn't make it any less *worth*

Cheers

ps:All said and done, I am given to understand that in an Indian context, this CFA holds up pretty good value...Ofcourse, its just my opinion

Tumtum....
I've heard enough horror stories of people not scraping thro' the ICFAI CFA...How the pass percentages are absymally low...and how there's a conspiracy(?) theory too that explains the low pass percentages.....

Hey Mad, could you elaborate a little on that one? Sounds interesting!

TumTum, if you`re convinced inside, you dont need to convince others. Due credit to your hard work etc., but the one thing i completely disagree with you is that ICFAI's CFA is wider in scope than that of AIMR. Having 32 exams doesn`t necessarily mean that it`s wider. You could split up ICFAI's 32 exams into 3200 baby exams, would that make it any tougher? Lets face it, ICFAI and AIMR are two different roads leading up to the same destination...one is shorter than the other, and is therefore more risky. The other might be longer and harder, but it takes you there for sure. Done?!

Best of all luck for April 2006

*****
See ICFAI CFA exam schedule for April 2006

Great Update TumTum .I know you must be loving your high paying investment banking job with global giant.You deserve it because apart from clearing your CFA ICFAI and CIIA, you have self belief, determination, energy to make things happen rather then waiting for them to happen. Great Dude. Keep it up and be always there to show us correct path.

Guys, hows your preparation going for different groups exams in April? Make it sure you have downloaded and printed your admit card.

Tumtum.... :thumbsup:
I've heard enough horror stories of people not scraping thro' the ICFAI CFA...How the pass percentages are absymally low...and how there's a conspiracy(?) theory too that explains the low pass percentages.....

All the very best :)

Cheers

@tumtum
Dude I feel like givin u a standing ovation
kudos to ur dedication and self belief
Really its people like u who constantly reiterate the fact that ur destiny is well and truly in ur hands.

-
Bugs

Dear friends,
I am really happy that people here are balanced and do not take degrees at their face value. Just for those who are doubting this degree and its recognition, I have a story to tell.

The year was 2001. I had just finished my graduation with a second class. When I started out scouting for degrees to add to my resume, I was wondering what should I do. I also asked myself the same questions that many ask themselves. To do an MBA or a CA or CFA (Indian or American) or whatever.

When I decided upon the CFA from ICFAI, the whole world told me its a wrong choice, its not recognised and blah blah. The following 3 years were the toughest in my life. I was doing CFA all on my own, without any inputs, developing my own rules and shortcuts and following newspapers, financial magazines and websites on a daily basis when the whole world was trying to put a sense of doubt in me.......that my decision of going for ICFAI CFA was WRONG. I created a group we wud study together and help each other outgrasp from each others doubts and gain from each others knowledge. However, many mocked that I wont ever get a job and that employers will just tear off my papers n not allow me to sit for an interview. All barked endlessly, while I believed in myself and kept on pursuing M.Com in Economics and CFA alongside. 3 years later, despite all the brouhaha....I finished both of these courses with a first class.

Then came the penultimate test of the belief that I had in this degree and in myself since the past 3 years of my life.....that of the MARKET ACCEPTANCE of this degree. I just left my hometown and came to Mumbai. No work ex and a supposedly "inferior" version of CFA on my resume. Without any leads, I started going to different companies wearing formal clothes (tie n all) and having my degree certificates, submitting my resume' to all n sundry. To my surprise, I found that CFA from ICFAI is a VERY VERY RESPECTED DEGREE and a LOT IN DEMAND. I immediately got a job at a very god KPO initially. I performed very well and was given 2 increments within 1.5 years. However, I was beginning to feel
like a back office monkey when suddenly a golden opportunity from one of the world's top 10 investment banks came to my hands but the million dollar question was......will an MNC accept the ICFAI CFA......???

For the first time, I was in a bit of self-doubt. But nevertheless, I decided to give an interview. It went on well and they were damn happy with my technical knowledge in finance. Then came the 2nd , the 3rd and the 4th round.......all damn technical stuff but I survived all with ease. Today....I am a Senior Analyst with that investment bank. This is the fun.....now all those who had left no stone unturned to criticise me cant even face me......and I still keep quiet and look them in the eye.....thanks to CFA.

What did you learn from this story friends? Simple.....

NO1) the employers are not concerned with what your degree is (initially they may be, but after some work-ex..they dont care a damn) or what your percentage is.
NO2) they are on the lookout for a personality that fits in their organizational culture....who has that fire in himself, who has the will to go that extra mile and keep learning.
NO3) no one is gonna welcome you with open arms because you are a US CFA holder...forget it....If you screw-up ur work...youre a dead duck.
NO4) no one is gonna throw you out of the office because you are an ICFAI CFA....thats so simple...you can see from my experience.

Just put yourself into an employers shoes, what would you personally do ? Would you go after someone's degrees or after someone experience and on job skills ? Think and then put forward a point. I have seen some guys spare no effort in criticising the ICFAI but they have nothing to fall back on except rumours that US CFA is the best. I no doubt agree that US CFA is a very good and a powerful degree....full marks to it....that course is goin on from the last 40 years, so US CFA IS A GOOD COURSE. But if US CFA is good, then in no way does it mean that ICFAI CFA is shit. In fact its a far wider course and very in-depth too. It gives you a solid grounding in finance just like its American counterpart. However, the beauty of this course lies in the fact that it is WIDER than US CFA. Just think......you give 3 exams (1 exam = 2 papers) for 3 levels of US CFA, whereas you give 32 papers for earning the ICFAI CFA. Then can such a degree be shit as these folks say ? Jus think for yourself.......ask yourself and put yourself in the employers shoes and then decide......you will never be wrong....after all, you have a live example in front of you.

In this long message, in case I have hurt anybody's feelings or beliefs, then I am sorry. I just said what was worthy of being told to clear misconceptions that many seem to have. If I have hurt anybody's feelings, then I ask for being forgiven.

Warm regards,

TUMTUM.