As said earlier this is again a black day in Indian History and losers like Arjun Singh will be smiling today on the downfall of democracy and victory of hypocisy

Well i would like to ask few questions

1) Would some ppl of OBC ppl getting into any IIM or IIT really helps in cast upliftment??
Are u trying to divide us rather thn uniting us by taking such stps???

2) Should much steps which provide solution at the root cause level be taken?? Providing education at nominal or free of cost.. We expect such steps from Govt rather than making reservation in Govt Instis?? Govt shud provide assistance to such students who want top pursue such studies by opening trainng centres so that these ppl can be trained to give JEE / CAT.. also underpreviliged ppl may be given coaching at nominal fees..take such steps rather thn bringing reservations.

Its a hard fact that majority of category students are not able to perform at the level expected at any IIT or an IIM, and this can be confirmed by the current / passed out B skoolers.

Till date we have certain category students who arent placed till last day of placements and then the IIM using their own back entry systems in getting such people placed.

IIT or IIM are Indias finest institues and i think we should atleast keep such instis away frm being politicised by the acts of people like Arjun Singh

I have nothing against the category ppl, but to get inot such instis u have to be a desired candidate and not a forced admit. I would like to be a part of an insti if i think i am desired and i really deserve to be there...Shouldnt the same funda be applied to the junta.. Y prejudicng for the OBC...

Just adding some caste to their names doesnt give them the rite to entry into any IIT / IIM with not even working hard enuff and other ppl screwing their life for this and finally not getting into suck b skools...

Till date a course like Chartered Accountancy hasnt been hampered by this reservation quota... Why?? because the paper checker doesnt know the name of the candidate.. they are not looking into the name of the candidate but their competence...
I would also like too add, with the IIM's increasing the fees to be autonomous they should now be Privatised rather than playing such filthy politics with such instis.

So i ll end it here

Its not the name 1 shud look for rather than the personal capability one should look for

Lets try and have a look at the logic behind this. all pro-reservation people too believe that admission should be indicative of knowledge and hard work. Their entire basis is that poor poeple work equally hard but just because they don't have the neccessary resources of books, study rooms, no requirement of part time jobs, etc they require to be uplifted. Now up to this point I totally agree.
Now despite the good base thought, politicians came to a decision that the best indicator of poor people/ underpriveleged in our country is the caste. total bollocks, i say. Not only is this system divisive, but also quite biased.
However whether these reservations will be helpful or not, I'm not going to comment on it as im unsure myself.
But again, I'd like to add, that the Courts could not have come to another decision. Its constitutional (I think otherwise though) according to SC. And thus it is assumed to be in the larger intrest of the nation.

Who comes in creamy layer?


The court had in 1992 asked the government to exclude the `creamy layer' from the purview of quotas to ensure that only the neediest among the OBCs benefited by reservation.
As per the principles laid down in the Mandal judgment, the children of constitutional functionaries including the President, judges of the Supreme Court and High Courts, members of the Union Public Service Commission, Groups A and B or Class I or II officers of the All-India Central and State services and children of public sector employees are excluded from reservation.

Quota jargon: what the court means by 'creamy layer'



Puys, No offsense but Half of the Pie is gone to those who can afford the entire one !!!

Why do the IIMs have to delay the results for the existing candidates in General and other categories when as per the Govt the General and other categories will not be affected by the OBC reservation
???

We can be reasonably sure that IIM results will not be released tomorrow

Heck! My chances of convert my calls are perhaps bleak now! Are they going to announce results on 11th as scheduled, or it's going to be delayed now? Any updates?

No way. Don't worry.

Or if they do revoke the offer, you can probably sue them for 100 crores. :)

Man.. Thank God.. I was really scared... I guess the OBC ppl will get seats over and above the ones already existing..

Just saw the news and was really upset.. How come these buggers always come up with some sort of nuisance everytime the IIMs come out with their results?? :new_evil:

A Similar Scenario witnessed in US

The traditional remedy was affirmative action: various measures by universities to ensure higher rates of black enrolment. Here, too, jurisprudence has pushed back, most notably in a 2003 Supreme Court ruling, Gratz v Bollinger. The court found that universities may seek diversity in admissions, but the mechanistic system used by the University of Michigan, which gave points to students merely for being black, was unconstitutional. A simultaneous ruling on Michigans law-school admissions programme provided some ambiguity, when the court said that an individualised, holistic review of each application could consider race as a factor. Voters in Michigan responded by approving a 2006 ballot measure that banned affirmative action. The issue may now arise in the presidential campaign. A prominent (and black) opponent of affirmative action, Ward Connerly, is trying to get an initiative on the ballots of five states that would ban public institutions from considering race, sex or ethnicity when, for example, hiring staff.
Affirmative actionand other effortshave certainly failed to rid America of sharp inequalities.

Source: http://www.economist.com/daily/news/displaystory.cfm?story_id=10982652⊤_story=1

P.S Is India also going on the same path, instead of bringing the underprivileged people in mainstream are we widening the gaps through such quotas?

monsterkarthik

Don't put ideas into Arjun singh's head by mentioning unreserved Educational Systems.

I have a really scary doubt... Now that the IITs have already come out with their results, Im wondering whether the already given admits will be snatched back for makin ways for the OBC guys??

If that was the case, I would be doomed... I mean my only admit is IITK.. And im f**kin nervous... :(

No way. Don't worry.

Or if they do revoke the offer, you can probably sue them for 100 crores.

Firstly : capricious :subject to, led by, or indicative of caprice or whim; erratic

I never said the court doesnt make good decisions...its just that at times it can change them or turn a blind eye to facts because its eyes cant see while grovelling in front of power and money...Remember Manu Sharma's case...and then do you remember what stance this same court had taken around a year back on this issue..and what about the million of pending court cases and the rampant corruption?

Boss, thats why I specifically said SUPREME COURT.

Its a hard fact that majority of category students are not able to perform at the level expected at any IIT or an IIM, and this can be confirmed by the current / passed out B skoolers.

Till date we have certain category students who arent placed till last day of placements and then the IIM using their own back entry systems in getting such people placed.

If the above statements have even an inkling of truth then its the IIM's who should be weary about the recent developments and who should have vehemently opposed the law...Which if they had done with the backing of industry and the big names on their boards and advisory committees, the law might not have been passed or might have been diluted...

my query is y are the IIM's accepting this in spite of knowing that a lot of them might not be up to the mark?

Cheers
Rj

Just in on National News: IIM results have been delayed.

I guess we all cannot escape our fates....

I have a really scary doubt... Now that the IITs have already come out with their results, Im wondering whether the already given admits will be snatched back for makin ways for the OBC guys??

If that was the case, I would be doomed... I mean my only admit is IITK.. And im f**kin nervous... :(

polpot Says

Firstly, my assumption is as sound as sound can be. You're calling the judiciary capricious without real proof. The judges may not fill you with confidence in this country, but I have utmost faith in the Supreme Court and its unbiased rulings.

Firstly : capricious :subject to, led by, or indicative of caprice or whim; erratic

I never said the court doesnt make good decisions...its just that at times it can change them or turn a blind eye to facts because its eyes cant see while grovelling in front of power and money...Remember Manu Sharma's case...and then do you remember what stance this same court had taken around a year back on this issue..and what about the million of pending court cases and the rampant corruption?

Just one comment on IIMs
Suppose we agree to the arguments of the govt
There are roughly 1100 IIM Seats for a country of 1.1 Billion people
That means there is just 1 IIM Seat for 1 million people
Just look at the ratio
Now if you reserve 50% of them for backward castes how will 550 people per year can uplift about 750 million people from social and economic backwardness

This is just an eyewash. Now the govt can wash its hands and can say "Inspite of so many hurdles and protests of the "upper caste oppressors" we worked earnestly for the upliftment of the depressed classes"

Many uneducated people will actually believe this argument

sunil251 Says

I cannot understand what is reason behind SC upholding the decision..tat to before d day of IIM's announcing the results...wat sense does this mean...I am CAT 2008 aspirant..and this type of 1 way decision shatters all d hopes of ppl like me preparing for CAT 2008...This is really disgusting part ....here ppl fight among themselves to be called backward class...wen we gonna develop this nation..if our fate is in d hands of this type of polticians...

The number of seats for open students will remain the same. And c'mon.. there are so many things that bog us down... But be sure, if you want to crack the CAT, you gotta be focussed and study hard... Thts the only thing that will put you through, Quota theatrics or not..// Cheers!!

OBC quota order: IIMs might defer admission list

As said earlier this is again a black day in Indian History and losers like Arjun Singh will be smiling today on the downfall of democracy and victory of hypocisy

Well i would like to ask few questions

1) Would some ppl of OBC ppl getting into any IIM or IIT really helps in cast upliftment??
Are u trying to divide us rather thn uniting us by taking such stps???

2) Should much steps which provide solution at the root cause level be taken?? Providing education at nominal or free of cost.. We expect such steps from Govt rather than making reservation in Govt Instis?? Govt shud provide assistance to such students who want top pursue such studies by opening trainng centres so that these ppl can be trained to give JEE / CAT.. also underpreviliged ppl may be given coaching at nominal fees..take such steps rather thn bringing reservations.

Its a hard fact that majority of category students are not able to perform at the level expected at any IIT or an IIM, and this can be confirmed by the current / passed out B skoolers.

Till date we have certain category students who arent placed till last day of placements and then the IIM using their own back entry systems in getting such people placed.

IIT or IIM are Indias finest institues and i think we should atleast keep such instis away frm being politicised by the acts of people like Arjun Singh

I have nothing against the category ppl, but to get inot such instis u have to be a desired candidate and not a forced admit. I would like to be a part of an insti if i think i am desired and i really deserve to be there...Shouldnt the same funda be applied to the junta.. Y prejudicng for the OBC...

Just adding some caste to their names doesnt give them the rite to entry into any IIT / IIM with not even working hard enuff and other ppl screwing their life for this and finally not getting into such b skools...

Till date a course like Chartered Accountancy hasnt been hampered by this reservation quota... Why?? because the paper checker doesnt know the name of the candidate.. they are not looking into the name of the candidate but their competence...
I would also like too add, with the IIM's increasing the fees to be autonomous they should now be Privatised rather than playing such filthy politics with such instis.

So i ll end it here

Its not the name 1 shud look for rather than the personal capability one should look for

will there be another list for gd/pi.....only for OBC category.....as this will not affect the tha meritorious candidates already selected......:(

I cannot understand what is reason behind SC upholding the decision..tat to before d day of IIM's announcing the results...wat sense does this mean...I am CAT 2008 aspirant..and this type of 1 way decision shatters all d hopes of ppl like me preparing for CAT 2008...This is really disgusting part ....here ppl fight among themselves to be called backward class...wen we gonna develop this nation..if our fate is in d hands of this type of polticians...

polpot Says

And even if someone wants to stand up and protest, still (through legal means,please).. Tell me one way to effectively do this. I've been inundated with calls since morning of hot blooded people saying that we have to protest. But how??? I really can't think of one way which can give me a remote chance to make my message fullfill its point. Anywho, like its said, no end to this. For some other time.

What you can do sitting in front of a computer:-

Digg:-

Digg - India's Supreme Court upholds 27% caste-based quotas to OBCs
Digg - Supreme Court Clears 49.5% Reservation Higher Education
Digg - Supreme court gives green signal to 27% OBC Reservation


Reddit. :)

Blog. Go to news sites that accept comments and speak out.

Any hackers here? Hack into all the Indian government websites and post anti-quota messages. (Kidding! ) (Disclaimer: I am not inciting a crime. I am just joking. Partly. )

In my opinion, the writing was on the wall wen the fee hikes were flying around.. wot we saw today was chapter 2..
Its a case of a neatly worked out compromise between the powers-that-be and the best of the instts.. you implement quota, we hike fees.. you keep quiet abt our act and we return the favour..
The 6th Pay Commission is merely an excuse..
Interesting, insightful and relevant read.. http://ttrammohan.blogspot.com/
A reasonable voice in the muddle.. the writer is a prof at IIMA.. (even otherwise, the posts are amazing and the blog is worth a regular visit)

As you say this, it seems so obvious...this ws a covenant which ws so inconspicuously executed that we just sat and stared...

1. "We will take them but who says we will pass them?" Unofficial unconfirmed reports from a student in IIMC claims that almost 20 out of 24 students politely asked to leave the institute on failing 3 papers, were from categories. So, more people might flunk out in the coming years. IIMs' way of maintaining quality standards.

I think we can do without these unofficial unconfirmed things. Post facts only if you can back them up.@All: Such threads are known to get nasty as people get emotional. Please be careful about what you post and make sure you do not cross the line.

comingback2life Says

What are you talking about sir?? Two wrongs cant make a right...A faulty policy in the first place and a capricious judiciary are not what a democracy is all about. Its a dysfunctional and venal democracy and we all are expressing our despair about this fact..Your argument albeit simplistic is built on a weak premise that the system is sound to begin with. Please verify your assumptions before you build your argument.

Firstly, my assumption is as sound as sound can be. You're calling the judiciary capricious without real proof. The judges may not fill you with confidence in this country, but I have utmost faith in the Supreme Court and its unbiased rulings. When Indira Gandhi wanted to have aboslute powers the Supreme Court struck this right down on challenge by a young lawyer known as Nani Palkhiwala in the Kesavnanda Bharti vs Kerela case. Point being that Supreme Court is fair and thus we can assume that the constitution does not disallow it. I again repeat, that i personally think its unconstitutional. I agree it may set a bad precedent. But thats not for the courts to see. I'm one who is going to be affected by this big time. So everyone don't attack me just because i don;t come all guns blazing against this ruling. Everyone has a right to opnion.

I did not like the law but the ruling couldn't have been different/

I thnk IIM's might consider OBC quota this yr itself and may probably delay announcing the results....here is the link OBC quota order: IIMs might defer admission list
This is really a black day in indian history

Now that the results will not be declared tomorrow makes the situation even worse
It is such a pain to wait for results.
Since my interview I was not able to think of anything except results and they are delaying it so much.

Same here - unable to concentrate on work ... kept delaying things to be done ... now this humbug!

Its very easy to blame politicians. Ayn Rand in her works had a basic message. Everyone in this world is selfish and will do everything for themselves. And so will our politicians. But its not a bad thing. Its the basis of Capitalism. It says that as long as people take care of their problems and enjoy their benefits, the world will be balanced.

The seats for Merit students remain same. OBC/SC/ST students have reservation, so they are happy. Government got what it wanted. They are happy. World is balanced. This is why we will never see effective protests. There was a huge uproar in the begining which meekly died out.

Well said my friend human being is basically selfish. Thats why we see a hoard of people coming on this thread to voice their disapproval. I understand it. Its a very cataclysmic decision.

People in this age have very low attention span. People protested when the 27% quota was first being tabled. But after someone approached the courts, protests stopped. Now again, it seems people will begin their rigmarole. The point is, our actions are driven purely by our selfish motives. Napoleon said, "Only two things can unite men fear and interest." We fear the quota and its in our interests that it goes away and so we come together on PG.

In the current scene, when HRD minister said that general seats will not go down, the general candidates were satisfied. That time they didnt consider the wisdom of the minister. Rajeev Goswami, the man who started it all during VP Singhs tenure as PM, died sometime back in a Delhi hospital forgotten, forsaken. But that didnt bother us. Now that we see ourselves being badly affected, we come here and write reams of things against quota.

Just a point on Ayn Rand and Capitalism. Greenspan, who is an avowed Rand fan, is being blamed for the current global melt-down thanks to his abiding faith in the vitality of the free markets. The same capital markets have just headed one way lately and its creating a whole lot of tension in the US (and everywhere else) in an election year.

I am out of race for IIMs. But that wont deter me from making it big in life.

In my opinion, the writing was on the wall wen the fee hikes were flying around.. wot we saw today was chapter 2..
Its a case of a neatly worked out compromise between the powers-that-be and the best of the instts.. you implement quota, we hike fees.. you keep quiet abt our act and we return the favour..
The 6th Pay Commission is merely an excuse..
Interesting, insightful and relevant read.. http://ttrammohan.blogspot.com/
A reasonable voice in the muddle.. the writer is a prof at IIMA.. (even otherwise, the posts are amazing and the blog is worth a regular visit)

even I second ur though.Script was already written, its just that the actors were backstage till date.While all hype was given to fees increase of IIMs.(U read Eco times of last few weeks , u will always find an article on it).The plot was getting ready at backyard.

No one of us felt that what fishy was going on.No one of us had an vague idea of such a twist in the tail.But our A Singh, waited for his entry at the climax.

Well we can just hope for happy ending . God knows when will this country learn to excel from front rather than cripping on backwardness.

Govt ...

shyamnaren Says

Altho its a welcome decision to preclude those in the 'creamy layer' from benefiting, I seriously doubt whether it can be implemented in spirit. To start with, annual income isn't a great way of determining whether or not people deserve the benefits of quota. There are 'n' no of ways of fudging income tax statements. And when an IIM seat is @ stake, you know where people will head. Also, those coming in from wealthy families but are not employed will avail of the benefits.

why the hell one need the reservation in iim. if really those bunch of idiot politician look for OBC growth then concentrate more on providing basic education and facility, open colleges specially for them.. why are they compromising when it comes to best in the country....and of course we know what creamy layer is at ground level..get up reserve education for poor dont reserve your votes..probably its time that the mangers of india take the opportunity to manage the country or else all we can expect from them is free TV, 25 kg of rice and all at the cost of our nation..

Now that the results will not be declared tomorrow makes the situation even worse
It is such a pain to wait for results.
Since my interview I was not able to think of anything except results and they are delaying it so much.

Now that KIL had already announced about their seat increase.

All this verdict means is that , Some Open category students will have to make way for the so-called unprivileged category.

No offense but I know a lot of general category students having severe financial crisis and a lot of so-called unprivileged category enjoying all the benefits of coaching and then they need quota.

God save this country....

I have a small doubt regarding this....
safely considering the fact the the final lists have been made as of now...
the increase in seats in LIK would have been taken care of...

even if the results are delayed...somehow i dont think that the institute will actually go ahead & remove a general category student from the list & give his seat to someone else

so the iims should have no problems in declaring atleast the decided results now...but as they say...anything is possible in india:)

PS : dont want to comment against anyone directly...but come on guys...saying that some people are able to afford coaching for cat justifies this reservation(there are many who dnt need coaching classes at all) isnt rational...
everyone wud probably agree on giving additional benefits only to those facing economic challanges...even though people can find loopholes around everything(examples given on the thread already)

In my opinion, the writing was on the wall wen the fee hikes were flying around.. wot we saw today was chapter 2..
Its a case of a neatly worked out compromise between the powers-that-be and the best of the instts.. you implement quota, we hike fees.. you keep quiet abt our act and we return the favour..
The 6th Pay Commission is merely an excuse..
Interesting, insightful and relevant read.. http://ttrammohan.blogspot.com/
A reasonable voice in the muddle.. the writer is a prof at IIMA.. (even otherwise, the posts are amazing and the blog is worth a regular visit)

Its a matter of a democracy functioning the way it is supposed to. In this scenario, the aggrieved parties did everything legal in their hands to protest.
Peaceful street protests, then moving to the courts, using the media. However none of this worked. It indicates the fact that somewhere down the line, these quotas were wanted by the people. .

What are you talking about sir?? Two wrongs cant make a right...A faulty policy in the first place and a capricious judiciary are not what a democracy is all about. Its a dysfunctional and venal democracy and we all are expressing our despair about this fact..Your argument albeit simplistic is built on a weak premise that the system is sound to begin with. Please verify your assumptions before you build your argument.

Are you saying that IIT's and NIT's are to be discounted...
For a majority of people applying to the IIT's also its number of years...

Applying your logic there are loads of private B schools...so y the hue and cry regarding reservation then?

Cheers
Rj

No what I meant was that the number of seats in Engineering colleges is in thousands and medical colleges is in hundreds. For Ex: if there are 2 seats in a stream of PG in a Medical College and this reservation goes on. Year 1 - ST, Y 2 - SC, Y3 OBC, Y4 Gen. So the cycle got extended because of Reservations.

Also you have an option of Private college (Read Management Quota) in Engineering which you don't have in Medical.

The additional years pinch the Medical Student a lot more than it does to an Engineer.

PS: I am not supporting this reservation

1. Waitlist movement of other premier institutions (MDI,FMS,XL) held up. IIMs being at the top of the pyramid will affect the waiting candidates of all the institutes at par or below them
   
2. "We will take them but who says we will pass them?" Unofficial unconfirmed reports from a student in IIMC claims that almost 20 out of 24 students politely asked to leave the institute on failing 3 papers, were from categories. So, more people might flunk out in the coming years. IIMs' way of maintaining quality standards.
   
3. Hope is a good thing! IIMs might... and just might... have taken such discrepancies into their account. They can still come out of all this unscathed. After all, this happened last year too.

IBN Live reports that people above 2.5L of annual income will come under creamy layer and will not be considered.

But when all the business people give fake income statement, will this be hard. I dont think so..

Meritocracy is a thing of past now.. I think now I will advice candidates on how to become a reserved caste by hook or by crook.. This will get better results than preparing for CAT. Anyway CAT is a lottery..

Will this ever change???

Altho its a welcome decision to preclude those in the 'creamy layer' from benefiting, I seriously doubt whether it can be implemented in spirit. To start with, annual income isn't a great way of determining whether or not people deserve the benefits of quota. There are 'n' no of ways of fudging income tax statements. And when an IIM seat is @ stake, you know where people will head. Also, those coming in from wealthy families but are not employed will avail of the benefits.

i have been patiently going through all the posts on this thread..and the discussion is mainly about 'will OBC reservation be implemented this year?'..(of course theres discussion abt is it justified or not)

but i fail to understand one thing..HOW CAN OBC RESERVATION BE IMPLEMENTED THIS YEAR? in my opinion this can never be done this year coz of 2 reasons:
1.only some iims like IIM Ahmedabad have given extra calls to OBC students anticipating such a situation..some iims have not given extra calls..so there has to be uniformity across all iims and that will not be possible this year.
2.I think noone has touched upon this point..the supreme court, in its verdict has clearly said that CREAMY LAYER HAS TO BE KEPT OUT..but i am not able to think of any way by which even the iims which have given extra calls to OBC candidates can eliminate persons from OBC belonging to creamy layer...

can anyone shed some light on this..
sorry if it has already been discussed and if i have missed to read some posts

IIM-Lucknow to implement quotas in three years: director - Thaindian News

I think this would be a case of Supply and Demand.

For Engineering students, there are enough colleges to attend (Need not be Top Quality) but when it comes to medical colleges there are very few seats.

For Engineering Students Reservations mean No. of Students. But for Medical Colleges like AIIMS its no. of years before its the turn of general category students to get that seat.

Are you saying that IIT's and NIT's are to be discounted...
For a majority of people applying to the IIT's also its number of years...

Applying your logic there are loads of private B schools...so y the hue and cry regarding reservation then?

Cheers
Rj

As ur quoting Ayn Rand, i'll just post a line of hers
"Every man is an end in himself, not a mean to the ends of others"
That is laissez faire capitalism
She's spoken against such politicians;called them looters;and their supporters moochers
Her books have the same msg-if i hv the merit and ability to do something,no one can and shud stop me from getting to my goal...thats the basis of capitalism...not the profit of filthy politicians

You're 100% correct. She was talking about merit. But it has the negative aspect. Like I said, noone's unhappy. so No action.

Agree with Polpot here...there were thousand of Medical students protesting on streets and trying to bring change...but where were we Engineers...busy sloggin away at MNC's and fattening our pockets...

We never did stand up and so we shall carry the albatross across our neck...

Peace
Rj

I think this would be a case of Supply and Demand.

For Engineering students, there are enough colleges to attend (Need not be Top Quality) but when it comes to medical colleges there are very few seats.

For Engineering Students Reservations mean No. of Students. But for Medical Colleges like AIIMS its no. of years before its the turn of general category students to get that seat.

And even if someone wants to stand up and protest, still (through legal means,please).. Tell me one way to effectively do this. I've been inundated with calls since morning of hot blooded people saying that we have to protest. But how??? I really can't think of one way which can give me a remote chance to make my message fullfill its point. Anywho, like its said, no end to this. For some other time.

Affirmative action is good provided it gives the results. If after 60 years of independence we still need quota then there is something seriously wrong somewhere.How has 15 years of reservation for SC/ST category helped the community? I dont think there are many cases where in a student who got benefits from the reservation has gone back to the community with some sort of vision or help. Indeed, it is our collective responsibilty to take everybody along as we progress, but In my viiew, those who reap the benefits of affirmative action.
Implementing quota in itself is so digressive and backward. Why do you wanna tell people that they are backward? Why cant the governement go back to OBC strongholds and teach students so they compete with this world. Why cant we have special schools from economically backward classes, Let the best minds in country go and teach at these schools. Nurture talent and then throw them in the rat race.

polpot Says

huge uproar in the begining which meekly died out.

Agree with Polpot here...there were thousand of Medical students protesting on streets and trying to bring change...but where were we Engineers...busy sloggin away at MNC's and fattening our pockets...

We never did stand up and so we shall carry the albatross across our neck...

Peace
Rj

Its very easy to blame politicians. Ayn Rand in her works had a basic message. Everyone in this world is selfish and will do everything for themselves. And so will our politicians. But its not a bad thing. Its the basis of Capitalism. It says that as long as people take care of their problems and enjoy their benefits, the world will be balanced.

The seats for Merit students remain same. OBC/SC/ST students have reservation, so they are happy. Government got what it wanted. They are happy. World is balanced. This is why we will never see effective protests. There was a huge uproar in the begining which meekly died out.

As ur quoting Ayn Rand, i'll just post a line of hers
"Every man is an end in himself, not a mean to the ends of others"
That is laissez faire capitalism
She's spoken against such politicians;called them looters;and their supporters moochers
Her books have the same msg-if i hv the merit and ability to do something,no one can and shud stop me from getting to my goal...thats the basis of capitalism...not the profit of filthy politicians

49.5% reservation??????????????????? Have we lost all senses while we're supporting political parties that are making stupid foolish rules just to get vote banks? its just preposterous
Indians should hold a place in the Guinness book and all odr record books for havin 50% quota...meaning that 1 of every 2 ppl who are going to an institute are not worth the merit to study there...
have we all gone blind...which way are we heading to...what society are we building...hope there was a DJ from RDB in real who wud've shot this
Hungry politicians are assaulting mother India for their gains...and we are waiting and watching...just meek and mute spectators
is this the future that Gandhi or even Ambedkar had wished for...I don't think so

One year of hardwork, one year of dedication, one year of continous focus on a goal is perhaps shattered today!!!
Reservation for IIMs - Is it the birth right of someone to study thr???
Sad.....we need a RANG DE BASANTI kind off revolution in this country!!!!
Economic Backwardness is the issue today!!!
As some one said, tis debate will go on for ever!!!
as IIM A has delayed, i guess all the IIM results will get postponed now!!

This exactly is the reason why things are the way they are. We "hope" , we "need", but we dont say, I will be the DJ who will DO this...

Others, lets discuss about what impact this decision will have and what are the options. But let us not indulge in saying things against each other.

Cheers,
Rohit

Just a reminder.

@polpot

Thats a problem with democracy. If it "benefits" a large segment of the population, then the decision will be taken. Correct or not. Good or bad.


A lot more I am not able to tell. Politicians want majority votes to win elections. Thats all. Period.


1. Tremendous hard work
2. Genuine interest in India's development
3. Long term view on India and not a short term next election viewpoint.


Basically it means these politicians have to start working.

So what is the easier way out:


Basically the politicians have taken the path of least resistance. Since it has benefited a majority of people, not much opposition also.

Its very easy to blame politicians. Ayn Rand in her works had a basic message. Everyone in this world is selfish and will do everything for themselves. And so will our politicians. But its not a bad thing. Its the basis of Capitalism. It says that as long as people take care of their problems and enjoy their benefits, the world will be balanced.

The seats for Merit students remain same. OBC/SC/ST students have reservation, so they are happy. Government got what it wanted. They are happy. World is balanced. This is why we will never see effective protests. There was a huge uproar in the begining which meekly died out.

Result might be delayed.
IIMA director said this.
The Hindu News Update Service

@polpot

Thats a problem with democracy. If it "benefits" a large segment of the population, then the decision will be taken. Correct or not. Good or bad.

Sample these:

1. Free colour TV's been given away at TN before elections
2. Now the same is going to happen in AP
3. 60,000 Cr loan waiver

A lot more I am not able to tell. Politicians want majority votes to win elections. Thats all. Period.

If at all the politicians genuinely wanted progress to happen in the country and wanted the backward to benefit, they would not have done this.

There are 2 things the government can do. One is genuinely work hard and improve the primary education scenario in the country. That will involve:

1. Tremendous hard work
2. Genuine interest in India's development
3. Long term view on India and not a short term next election viewpoint.


Basically it means these politicians have to start working.

So what is the easier way out:

1. Implement quotas based on some random percentage with no proper backing of research
2. Implement a quota based on caste and not financial capability
3. No need to sweat it out by creating universities (against creating schools). You already have IITs and IIMs. Ask them to increase facilities by hook or crook. After all, they have to win elections right.

Basically the politicians have taken the path of least resistance. Since it has benefited a majority of people, not much opposition also.

I did my schooling from Tamil Nadu.
Tamil nadu is a state which implements 69% reservation leaving 31% for the students in the general category.
I thought that i wouldn't have to face this amount of reservation anywhere else in my life.
Man i was proven wrong today.

Hail this historic verdict

One year of hardwork, one year of dedication, one year of continous focus on a goal is perhaps shattered today!!!
Reservation for IIMs - Is it the birth right of someone to study thr???
Sad.....we need a RANG DE BASANTI kind off revolution in this country!!!!
Economic Backwardness is the issue today!!!
As some one said, tis debate will go on for ever!!!
as IIM A has delayed, i guess all the IIM results will get postponed now!!

49.5% reservation??????????????????? Have we lost all senses while we're supporting political parties that are making stupid foolish rules just to get vote banks? its just preposterous
Indians should hold a place in the Guinness book and all odr record books for havin 50% quota...meaning that 1 of every 2 ppl who are going to an institute are not worth the merit to study there...
have we all gone blind...which way are we heading to...what society are we building...hope there was a DJ from RDB in real who wud've shot this
Hungry politicians are assaulting mother India for their gains...and we are waiting and watching...just meek and mute spectators
is this the future that Gandhi or even Ambedkar had wished for...I don't think so

I can bet 100% you are from the reserved category

100% Merit based, non OBC, non SC/ST student. Never used reservation in my life. I hate the way many closed minded people easily accuse me of being biased without understanding what Ive written.
Utsav Mehta, Mumbai based. NM College... Look me up anywhere... And keep your biases to yourself.

Edit: GnRS, sorruy...did not read your message, edit or delete mine if inappropriate.

Let me analyse what is wright and what is not.
2 persons, say A (general) and B (OBC) start climbing mt. everest. B has some defect in his right leg. so, to make the race more equitable B is given advantage by giving him extra time before A starts race (B starts early). I think that is justified to some extent.
.
Now, if a helicopter comes and puts B directly on top and declares him winner, that perhaps is not justified.

Similarly, a person who has availed reservation in college, avails the same at PG level and in job also. directly putting him on top without fighting for it.

I think a person must get reservation only once in life, either at college or PG level. Also, the ceiteria has to be economic backwardness and not caste.

Ne1 who has able to complete graduation in India, i dont think is poor. how many really poor graduates you guys personally know? And if this is the case that i dont know how reservation at PG level is going to help poor and deserving OBCs?

very true, Reservation was first implemented with an idea for 50 years so that one and maybe 2 generations benifit from it and are on equal footing with the open category but its 60 years since independance and instead of reducing the reservation we are increasing it. And i dont believe that the actual oppressed people in the reserved category are getting the benifits. its the creamy layer who walk away with these quotas.

I can bet 100% you are from the reserved category

Have been said umpteen number of times on pagalguy forums! No personal attacks!

Take a leave for one week.

Others, lets discuss about what impact this decision will have and what are the options. But let us not indulge in saying things against each other.

Cheers,
Rohit

Bhagwaan...bachao...I can't take this suspense any longer.....Somebody give me some concrete news...

comingback2life Says

Well written but beg to differ with you on that dude... Going by your logic only 1500 or so among the 2.4 lac CAT aspirants actually are good enough??I dont think so...In any case the problem with this whole OBC reservation mess is that its not got any solid numbers behind it,no driving logic and as only a few students will actually suffer from it (27 % in toto )so for the government its a great vote bank policy. Adding to that the IIMs have tried to expand..remember the IIM B campus in Singapore.It would have enabled them to tap on the faculty,research prospects and have more financial security. Regarding dilution of quality,do the names BITS Goa/ ICFAI xyz (not Hyderabad and the few others)/ IMT Nagpur come to mind??You might not even be knowing many maybe.. the constraints for setting up more instututes by the IIMs are a lot more than just land and electricity. My grievience is that a law has been passed in my country which has no sound basis and which will in many ways dilute the equity of these institutes and also shatter the dreams of many people whose only fault is that they are much more hardworking and capable and were not born in a certain caste. Its a tragedy and a conspiracy of silence,thats all I can say.

I never said only those who get IIM calls are good. I said if someone is good, he need not depend on IIM's to make it big in life. I take your point that it is not easy to expand for the IIM's. BUt then, expand they have to. I and K were started late but now are doing well. So let IIM's create a few more like Shillong. Overtime, with faculty interaction, etc they will come up.

I understand your frustration at the law being enacted. I too, to state the obvious, am none to happy with it. BUt friend, the duty of SC is to see that the law is in conformity with the laws of the land and the Constitution. If that is satisfied, the law will be deemed fit. About the merits/demerits of the law, that's the work of the legislature. The concept of creamy layer is well-defined but, in India, anything is open to abuse. So too with creamy layer.

@polpot

Thats a problem with democracy. If it "benefits" a large segment of the population, then the decision will be taken. Correct or not. Good or bad.

Sample these:

1. Free colour TV's been given away at TN before elections
2. Now the same is going to happen in AP
3. 60,000 Cr loan waiver

A lot more I am not able to tell. Politicians want majority votes to win elections. Thats all. Period.

If at all the politicians genuinely wanted progress to happen in the country and wanted the backward to benefit, they would not have done this.

There are 2 things the government can do. One is genuinely work hard and improve the primary education scenario in the country. That will involve:

1. Tremendous hard work
2. Genuine interest in India's development
3. Long term view on India and not a short term next election viewpoint.


Basically it means these politicians have to start working.

So what is the easier way out:

1. Implement quotas based on some random percentage with no proper backing of research
2. Implement a quota based on caste and not financial capability
3. No need to sweat it out by creating universities (against creating schools). You already have IITs and IIMs. Ask them to increase facilities by hook or crook. After all, they have to win elections right.

Basically the politicians have taken the path of least resistance. Since it has benefited a majority of people, not much opposition also.

I did my schooling from Tamil Nadu.
Tamil nadu is a state which implements 69% reservation leaving 31% for the students in the general category.
I thought that i wouldn't have to face this amount of reservation anywhere else in my life.
Man i was proven wrong today.

Hail this historic verdict

On TV, all I can make out about the IIM's is that IIM Ahmedabad has delayed its admissions by a week. Does that mean that the other IIM's will release the results tomorrow as planned?

No offense, but, this debate could go on till the cows come home. Any news on the status of results would be appreciated.