IIMs can teach for Free!! (?)

[chrismba]

just pennin some of my thoughts on the subject

furst up, i think the statement tat IIMs can teach for free is so obviously humbug.... i mean lotsa gud inst wud be able to bear expenses 'free' for some years based on their fin condition, and maybe for the IIMs this period extends by some more years... but wat after tat??..... do they sit down, beggin bowls in hand in front of the government?

moreover with respect to lowerin fees and government offering to pay the deficit, a question tat needs to be answered is whether the government shud really subsidise higher education...at a time when it is unable to cater to basic education needs ???.....
can India as a developing nation with around half of its populace beneath the poverty line afford tat?..... also considerin tat
a) loans are easily available
b) the loan amount wud most probably be recovered by the student soon enuf and
c) quite a few of the students wud most probably leave shores

i mean i wud be as happy as the next person to have 2 pay only 30 k for an MBA education, but thinkin un-individually is tat economically/socially viable?

further, with respect to the (in)famous huge corpus of the IIMs, Id read sometime back (cannot vouch for its veracity) tat the IIMs were looking to use this corpus to improve on-campus facilities and bring in visitin professors from foriegn univs as well..... tat wud indeed improve the quality of education even further..... ofcourse in the fracas tat has followed, no ones appeared to have paid ny attention to the proposed uses of the corpus, only to the fact of its being and current utility.....

one thing tat however cud be considered is improving the student intake.....
but the infrastructure shud support the increased intake.....
ofcourse bunchin tat with a reduction in fees as well doesnt help ...

nyways tat was mi 2 p.........

[Ankur15]

Hi satanincarnate..

I'll answer your things one by one

1)I didn't talk abt ISB fees.I just said that like Kellog's etc has done to ISB(by helping it),the same way IIMs can help smallet B schools produce quality managers.

2)I never talked abt faculties-part time or full time -I just said IIMs could help the country produce better managers instead of having a 3rd rate b school in evry nook and corner.

3)I agree Govt funding has been reduced.But my only question is..why were these funds not utilised.

4)Factually incorrect.Fees does go into IIM corpus.

5)I agree this is hypocrisy by the govt.Instead of focussing on primary education they just want some political mileage outta the IIM fee gimmick.

6)Autonomy should be a term which should be clearly defined.If it says having the lowest student to faculty ratio(around 4.5) when Harward has it as abt 10 cannot be accepted on grounds of so called "autonomy".Another fact..the IIMs have the one of the highest non teaching staff among all B schools!!

Wud welcome comments

Originally Posted by satanincarnate

1.ISB charges 14 lakhs per annum.
2.IIMs also have part time faculties from other better univs though i dont have the details.
3.Govt funding on IIMs has been reduced since then.
4.I dont think fees goes into increasing the corpus funds.
5.Govt itself said it will pay the shortfall in funds due to fee reduction- a deeper hole in govt pockets
6.IIMs ARE MORE CONCERNED ABOUT THEIR AUTONOMUS OPERATION BEING FURTHER AFFECTED. THE GOVT FAILED TO GIVE AN AFFIDAVIT TO THIS RESPECT DESPITE SC'S ASKING FOR IT.

Comments welcome.

[satanincarnate]

hey dood .. i had misunderstood ur comment abt ISB and had taken it to mean that IIMs are not providing as good an education via international affiliations like ISB.
am not sure but have heard that some iims run faculty development programs for other institutes .. will check upon this and post later .. moreover the funds given by govts have been used .. just coz they have big corpus doesnt mean they have been stacking up the fees or govt funds .. i had the impression the corpus is largely built upon the HUGE fees they charge the recruiters(http://www.iimahd.ernet.in/recruitme...cess_final.htm) and the fees they earn by consulting.
i also feel the student-teacher ratio at iims is quite high .. but an explanation is that a large no. of these are part-time which is not the case with other univs..
autonomy does mean non-interference in academic affairs and that does include faculty selection .. being from iit kharagpur i know how difficult it is for such institutes to acquire and retain high-class faculty.interference might mean some minister putting up a puppet of his as the dean/director of an insti .. believe me this is quite probable ..

all said and done ...if the iims have built up a huge corpus which they can use - shud the govt reduce its spending on iims or increase it .. totally beats me

[satanincarnate]

Saw a report in today's paper about shunglu committee findings ...
It says there are "irregularities" in the operation of 3 IIMs .. and then talks abt "financial" matters .. but it did not say anything abt "financial irregularities" .. trying to mislead or are there some financial irregularities?
Also it comes down heavily on ABC but not on LKI .. i think its coz the big ones are having huge corpuses .. but the last line of the article is also significant.
http://www.hindu.com/2004/05/06/stor...0605451100.htm

[Gordon]

well was going thru the above posts and cud not understand until i tried to figure out at spidey's link....have we blocked out the letters **********. from PG's vocab with asterisks?

well on a serious note on the topic:

we indians have always expected the govt. to dole out freebies to us. we always look for the concessions, rebates and wot not....not tht we r beggars but these things tend to go to the wrong ppl.

eg. look at the reservations in engg. they r meant for bright students who dont have the means to pay those fees. and see who gets those seats. ppl who can well aford to pay and those who aint tht bright.

same thing will happen here too. acc to MMJ he thinks the middle class will not b able to pay the fees. wht middle class is he talkin abt. the ppl at the lower end get eliminated at the coaching class level itself....they dont have access to material and classes and dont do so well or miss out by a whisker. in other words they dont get the edge.

the govt shud look at primary education. before starting at the top of the education pyramid. improve the lot of schools and sec. schools. start schools in rural areas rather thn give 10-20 crore to the each IIM. thn focus on junior colleges. and so on. mgmt. comes at the end.

however one mistake the IIMs did was tht they are not clean on their corpus / sources. why hasn't any IIM given a break up of its expenses and shown tht we need Rs. blah and we get Rs. blah and so we r not lowering the fees.

my 2 paise worth

XST

[alcatraz]

the IIMs have protested..............neways...The final fee is to be declared by the 10th of this month

[malladu]

Hi Guys,
While still on the topic of ****, MR Arindham says MBAs from the IIMs are not worth more than 1.8-2 lacs ..
Probably coz the avg sal of a **** passout is 2.2 lacs as he himself has quoted...
Moreover consider this, Mr Arindham wants an IIM grad to serve the country and the government instead of MNCs,, and also he wants 2000 grads per IIM,..NOw if 2000 grads were to passout from each IIM, no longer would MNCs come to recruit them owing to the probable fall in quality..They will have no other option but to serve the government..But does the govt have so many jobs lined up for these poor IIM grads then?? Or is Mr A planning to recruit them as faculty of ****???

[the STIFFmaester]

Mr.A says that IIM grads should not work for MNCs and should instead work for the country . But yet , in all the **** ads , he lays emphasis on ****'s "excellent" industry intreface and even highlights some of the prestigious MNCs in which **** grads are employed .

Double standars to the core

Nikhil

[satanincarnate]

What is the criteria for being called a management guru? Is it a title that publishers put on the books to make them bestsellers?

[IIM_ABCLIK]

Originally Posted by satanincarnate

What is the criteria for being called a management guru? Is it a title that publishers put on the books to make them bestsellers?

I guess the management guru title is self-inflicted by Mr. A to make more money and open more ****'s in various parts of country. But he shud know that a MBA institute is not by glass-clad buildings....
His punchline "Dare to think beyond IIMs" shud be converted something like "Dare to think better" for Mr. A for his double-standard views n thinking......



Cheers
Best of luck to all of u for results, since they are some hours away